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Sphlash

DELETE BOTS (solution)

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Sphlash    4

Botting is REAL and extreamly PERVASIVE in TI / Giran servers.

It is CANCER.

I suggest at least these SOLUTIONS:

1. Make restarts more often

2. Make dropable inventory (except equipped items) - bots would drop soulshots, spirit shots

3. HWID ban - ban hardware, instead of account / ip bans

This will make botting a BIT HARDER.

 

SHAME FOR PASSIVITY!!

1. Made 2 tickets with evidence of botting and neither of the cases were resolved ... SHAME!

[content moderated - Please report bots to Support, not on forums. Thank you!]

OPEN YOUR EYES NC WEST!

GUYS, PLEASE POST MORE EVIDENCE OF CLEAR BOTTING, WE NEED SOLUTION!!

Edited by Aurinya
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J0nSnow    34
37 minutes ago, Sphlash said:

Botting is REAL and extreamly PERVASIVE in TI / Giran servers.

It is CANCER.

I suggest at least these SOLUTIONS:

1. Make restarts more often

2. Make dropable inventory (except equipped items) - bots would drop soulshots, spirit shots

3. HWID ban - ban hardware, instead of account / ip bans

This will make botting a BIT HARDER.

 

SHAME FOR PASSIVITY!!

1. Made 2 tickets with evidence of botting and neither of the cases were resolved ... SHAME!

[content moderated - Please report bots to Support, not on forums. Thank you!]

OPEN YOUR EYES NC WEST!

GUYS, PLEASE POST MORE EVIDENCE OF CLEAR BOTTING, WE NEED SOLUTION!!

lvl 69 melle toon, with OE fists. You sure they aren't your bots?

NCwest will do nothing about it, they will continue to just bleed players and personal.  Margrot has already left for Ashes of creation. Once that game comes out, this game will be dead, unless they do something about bots, and the inevitable pvp scripting that will follow. Hardware should be banned 100%, much better than banning logical addresses. Once they announced that inventory items wouldn't drop from non-reds, we all should have known they were going to nothing about bots, but create a paradise in which they would thrive.  @Juji @Hime

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Devoid    122

Someone should really update the censor config to make sure people can't just publicly display their ignorance by creating threads like this.

  1. Hurts boxes and private store chars, no effect on bots
  2. Item drop was removed intentionally. It was a modification to the game explicitly requested by NCwest, so nothing will change here.
  3. Depending on how you compute the hardware configuration identifier, it might be PI. So any bot user can then plead GDPR to remove all PI stored by NCWest and they will be obliged to remove the ban. If it isn't PI, then you are banning random people in addition to the bot, which is not fair at all.

Regarding captcha, this "solution" also primarily hits boxes, shops and fishermen, since shops and fishermen have no chance to complete the captcha and will be banned while bots will just continue as they were.

 

TL;DR all suggestions in this thread are trash. l2p L2 and git gud

Edited by Devoid
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Sphlash    4

@Devoid - don't be ignorant, provide your solutions and / or evidence of botting.

Edited by Sphlash

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Devoid    122
3 minutes ago, Sphlash said:

@Devoid - don't be ignorant, provide your solutions and / or evidence of botting.

I already provided my solutions in a similar thread (if current forum's post counter doesn't lie) around 15 000 posts ago.

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Belenkas    1
4 minutes ago, Devoid said:

I already provided my solutions in a similar thread (if current forum's post counter doesn't lie) around 15 000 posts ago.

your post count is as irrelevant as the reply to the post. if you dont see the issue and / or are too ignorant to share your thoughts regarding it, just keep it to yourself

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Devoid    122
8 minutes ago, Belenkas said:

your post count is as irrelevant as the reply to the post. if you dont see the issue and / or are too ignorant to share your thoughts regarding it, just keep it to yourself

Not my post count, the forum's post count. This forum is filled with spam threads like this one and spam replies like yours (look at you, you are the OP's alt account that was created just a few minutes ago).

In my reply I thoroughly detailed the current situation regarding botting and exactly what can be done to achieve the largest results (hurting and/or deterring bots), all while still staying F2P and not needing live GMs, since apparently that is out of question here.

Unfortunately, thanks to constant spam threads with "solutions" that the author hopes they might work (without having any reasoning behind why they would), that thread (and my reply) is now buried under around 15k posts. Have fun finding it :)

 

TL;DR stop spam and stop creating alt accounts just to spam more

Edited by Devoid

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Belenkas    1
10 minutes ago, Devoid said:

Not my post count, the forum's post count. This forum is filled with spam threads like this one and spam replies like yours (look at you, you are the OP's alt account that was created just a few minutes ago).

In my reply I thoroughly detailed the current situation regarding botting and exactly what can be done to achieve the largest results (hurting and/or deterring bots), all while still staying F2P and not needing live GMs, since apparently that is out of question here.

Unfortunately, thanks to constant spam threads with "solutions" that the author hopes they might work (without having any reasoning behind why they would), that thread (and my reply) is now buried under around 15k posts. Have fun finding it :)

 

TL;DR stop spam and stop creating alt accounts just to spam more

lol... look at me..:D... no, I'm not OP's alt account. Yes, I do only have 1 post and recently created the account. Just decided to go through the struggle of creating one just to reply to your nonsense post. 

 

In your reply, you have thoroughly detailed the situation? which one? the one with censoring the config or the one with the inaccurate number of post (not yours - forums posts(thanks for making that clear)). maybe a link to the post would help people to have an idea on what you are trying to say? ohh wait, you have got 778 posts... all hail! king of the forum!! 

if you really cared about the spam and people posting "rubbish" you wouldn't be going through them and replying with your absolutely useless opinion.

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Devoid    122
31 minutes ago, Belenkas said:

In your reply, you have thoroughly detailed the situation? which one?

"regarding botting". First a bit of history (not the reply I was referring to):

On 10/22/2018 at 11:46 AM, Devoid said:

When GoD launched initially, they added a 'Museum' feature, where at the end of each month in Giran they would put statues depicting the players that did something more prominently than anyone else on the server.

One of the nominations were "most time spent in combat mode this month".

It wasn't long until people visited the statues and found out that the nominees with names like "afk5min" were spending roughly 22 hours/day IN COMBAT (calculated by taking total hours shown on the statue and dividing by days in month). Key thing here is that any downtime while you are not actively attacking/being attacked (like when you do buff rounds or go to town to sell drops) is not counted for this nomination!

Shortly after GoD, the museum system was removed from game. Bots/botmasters (yes, those were bots, not 3x8h CP shifts) were not banned.

There's absolutely no way NC will start banning rule violators now. Even though COMBAT time of 20+h/day for every day over an entire month AUTOMATICALLY GUARANTEES either botting or account sharing, both bannable offenses.

And then a very concise reply that identifies the primary cause and gives options (with examples) of how to counter it:

On 11/1/2018 at 8:08 PM, Devoid said:

@mixa was correct that the largest amounts of bot characters are run by companies, it is an organized business operation.

Which means we can get rid of them if we can kill their business plan. And for that there is an endless stream of options, starting from a simple 15-40USD/mo subscription (say VIP 0 at 15 USD, VIP 4 at 40 USD) and ending with 'on creation of each new account, we reserve 5 USD on your CC/PayPal/whatever, but if you don't get banned for botting in 28 days (28*24h) of in-combat time, this charge is cancelled' de-facto F2P model.

As for detection, they already have the self-similarity system AND they have the lin2log + lin2report audit/tracking. All that would need to be done is setting up a similar DB that logs player actions in higher detail and configuring the self-similarity neural net to work with the data stored there.

Of course, nobody wants to allocate any time/manpower/storage space/computing time to the deadbeat L2, but that doesn't mean a significant reduction in visible botting activity is impossible to achieve.

 

31 minutes ago, Belenkas said:

ohh wait, you have got 778 posts... all hail! king of the forum!!

Yet most of them were done before this forum was even created. Not entirely sure what your point was here; I had more posts in the deleted forum anyway.

31 minutes ago, Belenkas said:

if you really cared about the spam and people posting "rubbish" you wouldn't be going through them and replying with your absolutely useless opinion.

Well, the first three posters clearly set the quality bar of this thread. You don't sincerely expect to get insightful replies in a trash tier thread, do you?

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Shreekz    3
1 hour ago, Belenkas said:

lol... look at me..:D... no, I'm not OP's alt account. Yes, I do only have 1 post and recently created the account. Just decided to go through the struggle of creating one just to reply to your nonsense post. 

 

In your reply, you have thoroughly detailed the situation? which one? the one with censoring the config or the one with the inaccurate number of post (not yours - forums posts(thanks for making that clear)). maybe a link to the post would help people to have an idea on what you are trying to say? ohh wait, you have got 778 posts... all hail! king of the forum!! 

if you really cared about the spam and people posting "rubbish" you wouldn't be going through them and replying with your absolutely useless opinion.

Pretty sure that he was more illustrating that there have been several threads about this topic and you can search through and find others with some other (mostly bad) ideas to help with the bots. IMO, train them or pk them or drag a mob they are attacking real far away. Beat solutions to the bots.

I don't think @Devoid is trying to be mean or anything, it's just getting exhausting seeing another thread with the same bad ideas (no offense) every few days. However, I DO think your reply is rather indicative of the majority of the people on the forums. Complain, demand a solution, and refuse to do any work yourself (searching the forums for similar threads in this instance). 

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Deviliana    13
13 hours ago, Devoid said:

Someone should really update the censor config to make sure people can't just publicly display their ignorance by creating threads like this.

  1. Hurts boxes and private store chars, no effect on bots
  2. Item drop was removed intentionally. It was a modification to the game explicitly requested by NCwest, so nothing will change here.
  3. Depending on how you compute the hardware configuration identifier, it might be PI. So any bot user can then plead GDPR to remove all PI stored by NCWest and they will be obliged to remove the ban. If it isn't PI, then you are banning random people in addition to the bot, which is not fair at all.

Regarding captcha, this "solution" also primarily hits boxes, shops and fishermen, since shops and fishermen have no chance to complete the captcha and will be banned while bots will just continue as they were.

 

TL;DR all suggestions in this thread are trash. l2p L2 and git gud

If you are fishing or with shop open of course you don't need a captch. If player has shop or fishing actived, captcha = false.

 

My suggetion is: a GM with teleport/fly cheat to travel across the game world monitoring each major zone. Is not that hard to identify a bot. Just looking by the bot behavior and looping pattern and instant ban with no regrets. 

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Devoid    122
19 minutes ago, Deviliana said:

My suggetion is: a GM with teleport/fly cheat to travel across the game world monitoring each major zone. Is not that hard to identify a bot. Just looking by the bot behavior and looping pattern and instant ban with no regrets. 

This is an international server, so that means hiring GMs in three 8-hour shifts. Do you have any clue how expensive that is?

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46 minutes ago, Devoid said:

This is an international server, so that means hiring GMs in three 8-hour shifts. Do you have any clue how expensive that is?

There are many bots lvl40+. 1 hour in a week is enough to ban them.

 

Sorry my english

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Jorep    13
On 27/12/2018 at 7:20 PM, Goshirak said:

Just make a random captcha spawn between 00:00 and 23:59

 

if not completes it in 20 minutes, Ban

 

thats all

so if i leave my char online in town and go to drink a coffee i get a ban! very clever, hope your mom is proud of u

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Goshirak    4
55 minutes ago, Jorep said:

so if i leave my char online in town and go to drink a coffee i get a ban! very clever, hope your mom is proud of u

you cant get a captcha in town, thats the trick, try to report someone in town, you just cant, and fishing should be outside cities.

 

the solution against botters, is there

 

when BLIZZARD does a banwave in blizzard games, first, they kick everyone in the servers, many times along the day

 

then late, comes the banwave

 

this is the same, but better

 

wonder why a lot of suggestion in blizzard games, were applyied " my suggestions were heard "

same in TERA EME and RU my suggestion were HEARD

 

but here, they are not listening to me

 

we can beat the bots in a day with my solution and many others solution that i already sent to the ticket

 

do you know why im fighitng so much against bots?

 

1) because people calls me bot, when im a legit player with more than 1 computer, and this is nothing new, is done for more than 15 years, especially in this game because the command FOLLOW exists, if they erase the command FOLLOW of lineage 2, people as me that can handle more than 1 computer will disspear

 

2) because i want the game empty of bots, with no one botting, to they erase the bot report buttom from the game, because is used in a bad way by the people

3) because without bots, people when saws me, can finally NOT SAY that im a bot

 

how? the last survivor? no

 

cuz im legit, not a bot.

Edited by Goshirak

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Jorep    13
25 minutes ago, Goshirak said:

you cant get a captcha in town, thats the trick, try to report someone in town, you just cant, and fishing should be outside cities.

 

the solution against botters, is there

 

when BLIZZARD does a banwave in blizzard games, first, they kick everyone in the servers, many times along the day

 

then late, comes the banwave

 

this is the same, but better

 

wonder why a lot of suggestion in blizzard games, were applyied " my suggestions were heard "

same in TERA EME and RU my suggestion were HEARD

 

but here, they are not listening to me

 

we can beat the bots in a day with my solution and many others solution that i already sent to the ticket

 

do you know why im fighitng so much against bots?

 

1) because people calls me bot, when im a legit player with more than 1 computer, and this is nothing new, is done for more than 15 years, especially in this game because the command FOLLOW exists, if they erase the command FOLLOW of lineage 2, people as me that can handle more than 1 computer will disspear

 

2) because i want the game empty of bots, with no one botting, to they erase the bot report buttom from the game, because is used in a bad way by the people

3) because without bots, people when saws me, can finally NOT SAY that im a bot

 

how? the last survivor? no

 

cuz im legit, not a bot.

The times were i would care for strangers is over because simply they dont care about me! if u feel like helping us all good for u 

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Khania    19
20 minutes ago, Sphlash said:

@Juji @Hime in game, in forum, and especially in Discord people are ragging about bot problem - DO SOMETHING!! 

farming for one day without bsps in 3 hours i do with only one character, 300k money, imagine a bot that was farming 24 hours per day during 3 months and with 9 characters

 

24.300.000.000 of money

 

and you wonder why you have top d weapons +16 too soon?

 

BOTTING ADENA BUYERS

 

buy items d from shop, crystal it, buy enchant d weap in giran, enchant enchant enchant

 

and this means only for one botter, now, multiply 24.300.000.000 x 6000 = 

 

this is the total ammount of adena of botters in talking island and giran server

 

145800000000000, probabbly these botters are from the TOP GUILDS of each server, they will farm the EPICS First than all, win the olis first than all, and they are going to sell or use the epics and more selling in real life

 

then

 

game is destroyed by this people

 

Edited by Khania
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Spolier    5

We need the community to post about the bot problem, and NCWests blantant ignoring and even encouraging of the problem, on every twitter feed, facebook post, that NCWest puts out involving L2, and post all this in every MMO and gamer forum there is, to encourage people not to play here until they fix the problem. Hit them in the pocket books, is the only way anything changes. 

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Khania    19
1 minute ago, Spolier said:

We need the community to post about the bot problem, and NCWests blantant ignoring and even encouraging of the problem, on every twitter feed, facebook post, that NCWest puts out involving L2, and post all this in every MMO and gamer forum there is, to encourage people not to play here until they fix the problem. Hit them in the pocket books, is the only way anything changes. 

the bot problem destroyed the economy, this is the ammount of money collected by guild botters

 

145800000000000

 

did you wonder why many people has +16 weapons? well here is the answer

 

now how to fix it, check this post

https://forums.lineage2.com/topic/10239-reset-the-adena-ammount-and-erase-the-bots-guide/

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Gaspa    10

naive people fighting windmills.It became too late for any fixes once legit players became a minority compared to botters. you can even tell that by looking at forum,its like 20 people at most who complaining about bots,rest already left or just doesnt care anymore.truly sad of what this server has become. RIP classic NA 2018-2018

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On 12/27/2018 at 11:18 AM, Sphlash said:

Botting is REAL and extreamly PERVASIVE in TI / Giran servers.

It is CANCER.

I suggest at least these SOLUTIONS:

1. Make restarts more often

2. Make dropable inventory (except equipped items) - bots would drop soulshots, spirit shots

3. HWID ban - ban hardware, instead of account / ip bans

This will make botting a BIT HARDER.

 

SHAME FOR PASSIVITY!!

1. Made 2 tickets with evidence of botting and neither of the cases were resolved ... SHAME!

[content moderated - Please report bots to Support, not on forums. Thank you!]

OPEN YOUR EYES NC WEST!

GUYS, PLEASE POST MORE EVIDENCE OF CLEAR BOTTING, WE NEED SOLUTION!!

1. Is irrelevant to bots.

2. Dropping items on PVE death was part of the game for many years and was removed for good reasons. Botting was just as prevalent then. It was worse in a lot of ways because if you messed with a bot train the owner would bring a high level which may or may not be a perma red too. They definitely would train real players out of areas so they could bot..

3. No one has managed to successfully accomplish such a ban. Just check google and you'll find ways to work around HWID bans.

 

EDIT : I had completely forgotten about the museum thing. It was the same way on my server with the winners having typical bot names. I remember it being a complete joke.


 

Quote

when BLIZZARD does a banwave in blizzard games, first, they kick everyone in the servers, many times along the day

I have played WoW for far too many hours over the years. While I haven't played the game in a few years I have never experienced being kicked from a server during a ban wave. That would generate a lot of outrage on the forums and in social media. I just don't see that flying.

Edited by Tool_of_Society

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