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Ishmila

Debuff skills - no ability to magic crit

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Ishmila    4

I have tried to create a ticket to contact NCsoft about the summoner marks not having the ability to magic crit , their response: 
GM Than Thursday at 23:43

Hi again, 

As we have further investigate the issue the summoner mark skill is working as intended and categorized as "Weaken" (Debuffs) skills which is are not generally not going to have the same properties as a nuking spell or main attack skills where skill critical occurs. 

Feel free to contact us again if you have any further question.

Regards, 

GM Than
NCSOFT Support Team

 

Now as far as I am concerned the marks are the summoners main skills and only way to do any pvp damage and we cant magic crit the skills?  that seems broken to me and this needs to be fixed.    I asked NC for the main skills of a summoner and they told me to go to forums and they didnt have that info.  

ALSO based on this Warcryer ISS have the freezing flame skill which is considered a debuff but it CAN crit, so I want to know why there is an inconsistency in allowing debuff skills to crit while others cant.  

 

 

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mixa    236
11 hours ago, Ishmila said:

I have tried to create a ticket to contact NCsoft about the summoner marks not having the ability to magic crit , their response: 
GM Than Thursday at 23:43

Hi again, 

As we have further investigate the issue the summoner mark skill is working as intended and categorized as "Weaken" (Debuffs) skills which is are not generally not going to have the same properties as a nuking spell or main attack skills where skill critical occurs. 

Feel free to contact us again if you have any further question.

Regards, 

GM Than
NCSOFT Support Team

 

Now as far as I am concerned the marks are the summoners main skills and only way to do any pvp damage and we cant magic crit the skills?  that seems broken to me and this needs to be fixed.    I asked NC for the main skills of a summoner and they told me to go to forums and they didnt have that info.  

ALSO based on this Warcryer ISS have the freezing flame skill which is considered a debuff but it CAN crit, so I want to know why there is an inconsistency in allowing debuff skills to crit while others cant.  

 

 

Your marks have the ability to weaken the target, whereas the freezing flame is a drain skill first. You're making a wrong analogy here and then you wonder why it's different.....amazin' xD

Further more, you have 4 marks work virtually zero reuse, where DC has one with ~4s reuse.

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Ishmila    4

I am stating the fact they told me that debuffs do not crit and I Am pointing out that freezing flame does crit and it categorized as a debuff.  So their classification on what can magic crit is wrong and they either need to change it or let summoner marks crit too since that is summoners main class skill. 

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weinerthezon    28
On ‎12‎/‎31‎/‎2018 at 2:41 AM, Ishmila said:

I have tried to create a ticket to contact NCsoft about the summoner marks not having the ability to magic crit , their response: 
GM Than Thursday at 23:43

Hi again, 

As we have further investigate the issue the summoner mark skill is working as intended and categorized as "Weaken" (Debuffs) skills which is are not generally not going to have the same properties as a nuking spell or main attack skills where skill critical occurs. 

Feel free to contact us again if you have any further question.

Regards, 

GM Than
NCSOFT Support Team

 

Now as far as I am concerned the marks are the summoners main skills and only way to do any pvp damage and we cant magic crit the skills?  that seems broken to me and this needs to be fixed.    I asked NC for the main skills of a summoner and they told me to go to forums and they didnt have that info.  

ALSO based on this Warcryer ISS have the freezing flame skill which is considered a debuff but it CAN crit, so I want to know why there is an inconsistency in allowing debuff skills to crit while others cant.  

 

 

Taking away marks ability to crit sucks but the bigger issue is the pets 1000+% pvp dmg nerf lol.

Summoners were overpowered for 1 chronicle when we got 4 pets, and people cried for days. My 4 reapers were critting for 2-3k  per crit and apparently that was too strong, but archers and wizards can crit for 500k. so ncsoft nerfed summons pvp dmg by 1000% and took 2 pets away. It was the biggest nerf in the history of L2 and it was never corrected. I can crit raid bosses with my pets for 1million dmg, but in pvp I am lucky to crit for 200 dmg with pets. 

But don't worry, retributer passive going from 100% to 120% next update!......

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Posted (edited)
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Now as far as I am concerned the marks are the summoners main skills and only way to do any pvp damage

The summoners main skills are the summons, not the marks, as the class name tell us: Summoner, not Markmoner. The debuff role is more suitable for necromancers, overlords and iss enchanters gameplay.

But OK, summons are broken and only the marks are working for pvp as such an OP dot, but it is not the correct gameplay for summoners since they dont need the summon to fight... Your complaint would be about gameplay, not about marks. Anyway the summoner update is coming packed with Fafurion update, so wait for it.

Edited by ShakaDeVirgem
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NemesiC    28

I really cannot imagine the time  wynn had 4 pets. the nurf was huge....
As wynn pve  concerning, you are playing with leather amor and fighter ability points
As wynn pvp concerning , robe is required and most of us prefer Defence ability points/rare ppl with end game items prefer wiz.i dont think wynn need m crit on marcs, u have 0 sec reuse.the job of a wynn in pvp is to keep him alive as more as he can.
For mass pvp is useless  but for 1vs1  wynn is extremely hard to loose.

The fact is that there is no balance and never will be , especially for wynns is a disaster but we cannot do nothing about it....BUT i like my wynn so i wont stop playing:P
 

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Posted (edited)

 

29 minutes ago, NemesiC said:

As wynn pve  concerning, you are playing with leather amor and fighter ability points
As wynn pvp concerning , robe is required

I agree, NCSoft has never been good on designing the summoner gameplay... not using summons but the marks is like an Archer not using arrows but dot debuffs... something seems wrong here.

One of the main summoner problems is the "scalling" issue: Pet abilities does not scale very well as the owner abilities scale. Servitor Share + Equipment Share were made for that purpose as a kind of workaround, but as we can see they are not working: 

  • Why 2 skills for sharing?
  • Why they are buffs but not passives?
  • Most ppl believe that "Equipment Share" still shares only pvp/pve attributes, why not share all attributes from circlets, cloaks, belts, shirts, etc... what the point of acquiring a new item that does not affect your main skill (summons)?

From my experience from other well designed RPG games, the summoner is a wizard whose main attribute is the intelligence (INT) and its summoned creatures get stronger as the summoner intelligence increases: weak summoners call weak pets, strong summoners call strong pets. As result, there is no need to have STR/patk to be shared. Also, summoned creatures usually have passive skills, e.g. "skeletal body" that makes skeletons more resistent to arrows. It is a very simple and reasonable gameplay design that L2 is lacking. 

Edited by ShakaDeVirgem
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NemesiC    28

True sad story my friend ShakaDeVirgem !!!

Also there are no beast spiritshot consumption....no needed from any high lvl pet ...

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Helv    90
2 hours ago, ShakaDeVirgem said:

 

I agree, NCSoft has never been good on designing the summoner gameplay... not using summons but the marks is like an Archer not using arrows but dot debuffs... something seems wrong here.

One of the main summoner problems is the "scalling" issue: Pet abilities does not scale very well as the owner abilities scale. Servitor Share + Equipment Share were made for that purpose as a kind of workaround, but as we can see they are not working: 

  • Why 2 skills for sharing?
  • Why they are buffs but not passives?
  • Most ppl believe that "Equipment Share" still shares only pvp/pve attributes, why not share all attributes from circlets, cloaks, belts, shirts, etc... what the point of acquiring a new item that does not affect your main skill (summons)?

From my experience from other well designed RPG games, the summoner is a wizard whose main attribute is the intelligence (INT) and its summoned creatures get stronger as the summoner intelligence increases: weak summoners call weak pets, strong summoners call strong pets. As result, there is no need to have STR/patk to be shared. Also, summoned creatures usually have passive skills, e.g. "skeletal body" that makes skeletons more resistent to arrows. It is a very simple and reasonable gameplay design that L2 is lacking. 

+1, I couldn't agree more. Pet abilities scale horribly.

However, if NC Soft do not feel like reworking the whole system, they could at least give our pets a strong AOE skill so that wynns can be welcome in Faction group farm parties. Now I'm excluded from all of them.

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NemesiC    28

That AOE skill would be ideal !!!

Noone loves wynns atm ;/ and you cannot solo farm above 104 (im 106 btw), its not a solo game its a group game.....

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Varhalla    0
Quote

Now as far as I am concerned the marks are the summoners main skills and only way to do any pvp damage and we cant magic crit the skills?  that seems broken to me and this needs to be fixed.    I asked NC for the main skills of a summoner and they told me to go to forums and they didnt have that info.  

ALSO based on this Warcryer ISS have the freezing flame skill which is considered a debuff but it CAN crit, so I want to know why there is an inconsistency in allowing debuff skills to crit while others cant.

Hmmmmm, interesting.

I read this player's message as "Hey I am mediocre at best when I play my summoner; and I just can't seem to get ahead in the game when I pvp.  I know!  I will whine and cry up a river of tears in the official L2 forum, maybe I will get some sympathy, if nothing else.

Also, let's pick on the Warcryers!  Yeah that's brilliant!

--------------------

My reply to this nonsense:

1: Put more effort into learning and understanding your class.

2: Think of it as driving a car, there are just some drivers far better than other drivers; some people are just not capable of doing a good job of driving a car nor playing a summoner.

3: Lots of people will give you advice. Some people give good advice, and some people give bad advice.  Don't listen to the bad advice.

4: Nobody likes a nit-picker.

3: Consider re-rolling to another class, maybe there is some other class you could play better, suck at less, or find easier to play.

4: Hey here's an idea!  If you think ISS's are so Over-Powered (OP) why don't you just go play one for yourself and own the pvp field?

You should not let it bother you though when you find you are dying a lot, and more-so than you think you should be, (you can always cry about it, right?)

Don't let it bother you when you reach a certain level and suddenly discover you do not have any place to solo grind anymore like you used to have when you were a lower level.

If you do happen by chance to make a DoomCryer ISS, you will not have regular Sonatas anymore; the DoomCryer version of Sonatas are called Drums.

The DoomCryer's Drums (Sonatas) WERE ALREADY NERFED, if you haven't noticed.

When I did have regular +10 Sonatas they lasted 7 minutes.

Then they were nerfed into being Drums, NOT Sonatas anymore.

Now my +10 Drums last a whole 3 minutes long and NO, I am NOT complaining.  I have learned to live with the inconvenience and have gotten over it.

Life goes on.

Stop being a whiney complainer already.

-----------------------

Varhalla,  101 DoomCryer ISS

Chronos server

DWO clan

 

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Ishmila    4

So to sum up a few points made including the initial post : 

  • summoners marks cant magic crit
  • equipment stats do not share with summons
    • summons receive more damage in pvp  
    • summons give reduced dmd in pvp
  • summons dont scale with game
  • pets cap at 105 but most players 108+ get extra crit chance and dmg , gives a critical disadvantage 

 

Some suggested corrections

  1. Fix skills, either make all magic debuff skills crit or take away ALL those abilities from other classes to make equal for skill descriptions. 
  2. Fix equipment sharing to actually give pets all skills that summoner passives give , this is not happening at all. 
  3. fix pets, scale to do more damage in pvp and increase stats.  

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