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Flinsh

Sadly its about bots

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Flinsh    1

Hello,

Im new Giran server player. There are to much bots here :(

For example "Execution Grounds" east of Dion is full of bots. I know NC Soft want to make money but pliz this is to much, GM pliz check it.

Also the "Bot report button" can be used only once for 30 min and have limit. This is wrong, it is far not enough! If You really want to make this game better place for players there should be more focus on bot problem from NC Soft.

 

Hope someone form staff will read this and replay

Cheers!

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LifeChat    3

3 months server GIRAN= 3450 online (afternoon time) with afk shops,afk fishing bots , Bots everywhere and 2-3 accounts per character. imagine after 2-3 months ...500 real players online MAX.:(:( 

Edited by LifeChat

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Bousette    9

NCSoft receive a % of money from GoldSellers, so forget about crying about bots. This post its gonna be closed by a mod.

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Shreekz    3

It is now that you're accusing ncsoft of being corrupt.  Unfortunately the bots are just going to be an endless battle you never win. At the end if the day, this game is free to play so they can always make more accounts. Personally, I would like to see the old pk rules back along with chance to drop when dying from mobs.

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7 hours ago, Bousette said:

NCSoft receive a % of money from GoldSellers, so forget about crying about bots. This post its gonna be closed by a mod.

That is one of the dumbest things I've read on this forum. The talking point that Ncsoft is somehow receiving money from the bots/rmters/etc. It's dumb

First off how is Ncsoft hiding that money? It's nowhere in any of the information they are required by law to release (it would be if it was happening). The stock holders aren't seeing it either. You're talking about a game that has earned Ncsoft over $2 billion so far and you think that a tiny cut of rmt and bots is worth breaking laws in multiple countries for? It's absolutely stupid. Ncsoft would also have to hide the money from the thousands of employees it has. If you read glass door reviews most former employees of ncsoft are definitely not happy at the company and would be more than willing expose such illegal activity.

All that illegal activity so they can earn a few extra drops worth of cash in their lake of money. A few extra drops that would be countered by people quitting due to the bots/rmt spam. All future ncsoft published games are tainted by the common knowledge that ncsoft games are botfests. So further money would be lost in future sales for a few drops of RMT cash today. It makes no sense at all.


What does make sense is that people can create and start up dozens to hundreds of accounts to bot in a day. You can ban most of them but you'll never get them all. Sometimes even when you get them it's been weeks/months since they started. Techniques to slow that down also sometimes catches legit people and those are the ones that get unsuspended after a review of the security system's flag.
 

Quote


It is now that you're accusing ncsoft of being corrupt.  Unfortunately the bots are just going to be an endless battle you never win. At the end if the day, this game is free to play so they can always make more accounts. Personally, I would like to see the old pk rules back along with chance to drop when dying from mobs.

 

No you don't (item drop on death) It had no effect on the bot population and it was actively abused by both botters and non botters to grief lower level players. You haven't lived in l2 till you've had a bot master mob train you out of an area so their bot train can run.

It was removed for some very good reasons and will not be returned.

Edited by Tool_of_Society

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heavychick    11
11 hours ago, Tool_of_Society said:

That is one of the dumbest things I've read on this forum. The talking point that Ncsoft is somehow receiving money from the bots/rmters/etc. It's dumb

First off how is Ncsoft hiding that money? It's nowhere in any of the information they are required by law to release (it would be if it was happening). The stock holders aren't seeing it either. You're talking about a game that has earned Ncsoft over $2 billion so far and you think that a tiny cut of rmt and bots is worth breaking laws in multiple countries for? It's absolutely stupid. Ncsoft would also have to hide the money from the thousands of employees it has. If you read glass door reviews most former employees of ncsoft are definitely not happy at the company and would be more than willing expose such illegal activity.

All that illegal activity so they can earn a few extra drops worth of cash in their lake of money. A few extra drops that would be countered by people quitting due to the bots/rmt spam. All future ncsoft published games are tainted by the common knowledge that ncsoft games are botfests. So further money would be lost in future sales for a few drops of RMT cash today. It makes no sense at all.


What does make sense is that people can create and start up dozens to hundreds of accounts to bot in a day. You can ban most of them but you'll never get them all. Sometimes even when you get them it's been weeks/months since they started. Techniques to slow that down also sometimes catches legit people and those are the ones that get unsuspended after a review of the security system's flag.
 

No you don't (item drop on death) It had no effect on the bot population and it was actively abused by both botters and non botters to grief lower level players. You haven't lived in l2 till you've had a bot master mob train you out of an area so their bot train can run.

It was removed for some very good reasons and will not be returned.

I agree with some of what you are saying but do you really think it's a few extra drops of cash?  I'm willing to bet adena sellers are making more profit off this classic then ncsoft them selves.

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19 hours ago, heavychick said:

I agree with some of what you are saying but do you really think it's a few extra drops of cash?  I'm willing to bet adena sellers are making more profit off this classic then ncsoft them selves.

I find it highly unlikely that gold farmers are making more off classic than ncsoft. I would be surprised if most of those advertising aren't just straight up scams. I imagine stealing credit cards can be pretty profitable though.

Regardless even if we go with that assumption then in the above scenario/conspiracy theory NCsoft would still only be receiving a fraction of the gold farmer's income as kickback.

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tattor    2

This is dumb,are u guys serious?

U understand nc soft can create adena since is its game right?
Whats the point of taking a part of money from an adena seller when u own the creation of adena?

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Cally    20

Yeah, the botter population is totally out of control...
Wherever you go... Cruma Marshland, plains of Dion, Plains of the lizardmen... You barely find a spot that is not covered by bots. (Except maybe high lvl areas.
I already made efforts to ban some bots. When I found a nice hunting ground, I started to make some tests to gigure out who is a bot and who not... apperenty all were bots.
I documented the behavior, prooved it by killing the bots with social aggro mobs and watched em return automatically to the battlefield and continue farming.
Then I made a list with the bot names an dreported it to NCsoft.
After a day almost all of the bots have been banned and I was able to farm on that spot for one day... maybe even two.
Then new bots returned and it was again so crowded that farming was no longer possible.... repeating the process.

Unfortunately is this process very time consuming and the "bot test" can only be done with social aggro mobs.... and when enough mobs are around to do that.
I can't really think of a other solution, than ingame GMs that cross the maps every day and lookout for botting behavior and take action there.
But this costs money and one GM can maybe investigate only 200 bots a day. :/

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Buldos    21
1 hour ago, Cally said:

I can't really think of a other solution, than ingame GMs that cross the maps every day and lookout for botting behavior and take action there.

Even one live "bot hunter" will not solve a problem with bots crowds. Only one thing can beat bots - players shoult stop buying adena. So first of all GM's should punish players who buy adena. Mb it's shouldn't be bann but it's should removing of adena boughted for real money and gear boughted with dirty adena. When players will afraid of punishment and stop buy adena then bots gone cuz there will be no reason spend time for farm adena wich no one buy. But if boting will bring profit to botters they will continue creat new toons new trains and farm farm farm...

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Cally    20
18 hours ago, Buldos said:

Even one live "bot hunter" will not solve a problem with bots crowds. Only one thing can beat bots - players shoult stop buying adena. So first of all GM's should punish players who buy adena. Mb it's shouldn't be bann but it's should removing of adena boughted for real money and gear boughted with dirty adena. When players will afraid of punishment and stop buy adena then bots gone cuz there will be no reason spend time for farm adena wich no one buy. But if boting will bring profit to botters they will continue creat new toons new trains and farm farm farm...

And what it with all those players who bot for their own profit?
I don't think this are a few.

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Buldos    21
1 hour ago, Cally said:

And what it with all those players who bot for their own profit?
I don't think this are a few.

Cancer can't be fully cured at one procedure and need step by step healing plan. And first step should be fight with RMT.

RMT might be legalised and exclude 3rd party traders - enough make NC Coins tradable items (with basic price 0 adena) and let players buy/sell them in game for adena. Farmers who run bot trains and adena sellers don't need NC coins, they need cash. Players who still will buy adena from 3rd party traders should be punished - removing boughted adena/items or bann.

Bot trains used for farming adena for own use on main characters need investigations. No enough bann bots, need follow for adena way till main "innocent" character and punish main with bot. It's might be perma bann from 1st violation or rule of 3 strikes like :

1st strike remove adena/items transfered from bots and yellow mark on main account as potential violator for future control, permanent bann accounts used for automated farm(bots)

2nd strike remove all adena/items from main character and red mark on main account as potential violator for future control, permanent bann bots and temporary bann main account

3rd strike permanent bann all related accounts

If can't fight with illegal stuff then why not make it's legal and take under state control? It's work with drugs/prostitution in real life so why it's can't work in game with adena market? I'm playing this game since the end of 2005 and all this time GMs was fighting bots and RMT. "A holy place is never empty" and every banned train will be replaced - it's was so and so will be while it will be profitable.

But it's only my vision how make this game more hearthier and there might be other ways. Method of banning punishers wasn't worked when game was pay2play with monthly fee so why it's should work now with free2play model?

Edited by Buldos

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2 hours ago, Cally said:

And what it with all those players who bot for their own profit?
I don't think this are a few.

Based on my own personal experience the majority of in game self professed bot hunters can't tell the difference between a real bot and a character following another via in game macros..There are some people who have posted on these forums about their bot hunting AND were actually logical about it but they are by far the tiny minority :( So bots are a bit over estimated to some extent.


@Buldos

I've often wondered why NCsoft didn't go about making it easier for people to sell NCcoins in game. There are quite a lot of MMORPGS out there (including WoW) that use some kind of similar system to combat RMT. In eve online PLEX absolutely destroyed the gold spam and most of the farmers. There are still farmers hiding out in null and stuff but they don't operate like they used to.

Part of the "OMG I WAS BANNED FOR NO REASONS" comes from people sharing accounts with someone that bots alts. That stuff does tend to get traced back to other characters being used by the same person.

Edited by Tool_of_Society

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