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PabloC

Greater Heal problem?

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PabloC    0

Hello everybody. I'm a bishop and I have been noticing that Greater Heal is not entirely healing as much as expected from years of experience. I know there are many issued in NA servers right now, buy haven't read anyone talking about this one in particular, so that's why I make this thread. In order to provide evidence, I run a quick test and made some math so you can easily see my point. Test have been done with a lv. 42 Bishop with a D grade weapon (42 m atk) using BSSD and wearing a divine set.

The skills I used were:

 

Greater Heal lv. 4

Power: 376 acording to skill description

MP Cost: 64

 

Heal lv 18

Power: 301 acording to skill description.

MP Cost: 52

 

That means that Greater Heal lv 4 has an effective cost of 5.875 power/MP and heal has and effective cost of 5.78846 power/MP. Logic dictates that Greater Heal has better cost / benefit relation, but in practice is not.

In my test, with Greater Heal lv 4, I healed my self for 540 HP, whil with Heal lv 18 I healed my self for 463 HP, both with same weapon, buffs, set, and bssd activated.

That means that with Heal lv 18, I healed for 8.9038 HP/MP, and with Greater Heal lv 4 I healed for 8.4375 HP/MP. That means that Greater Heal has worse cost / benefit relation, the oposite at what should be acording to skill power.

In other words: Heal lv 18 heals for 1.5382 HP / Power, while Greater Heal heals for 1.43617 HP / Power. Why there's a difference? Doesn't make any sense at all.

I hope you didn't got bored and confused with all the math and numbers, just trying to prove that this is not working as it should be by logic. What's the point on learning a lv 42 skill if is less cost effective than the one that I learned at lv 35? And more important, why healing power is not equal among both skills? If healing power represents an estable value, a skill with 372 healing power should heal 124% more than one with healing power of 301, not 117% more; it just doesn't make any sense at all.

Please gms, look this problem. Thank you.

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AngeMarkel    14

U shouldnt start to try to explain game mechanics to your self by logic. Because if u go like this u will notice, that 99% of the skills doesnt makes sense.

All the Power measures of skills have different hidden values and calculations/formulas behind.

About the Mana thing, u just see the cost efficiency but not the heal and time efficency.

So even, when greater heal costs more mana/hp point, it heals more hp in this moment. In later game stages this heal gap will be much bigger and its a difference in pvp/pve situations, if u get healed for 800hp in 1 heal or just around 400 (which means that u need 2x heal to have the same effect).

 

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PabloC    0

Game mechanics have a logic, that's why they are mechanics and not things that happen. If a game skill power is the double of similar game skill power, in same context results should be double. Since Heal is not affected by rng, I'm providing evidence that is either not working properly or not decribed properly.

Saying that 99% of the skills doesn't make sense is a stament you have made but you don't give any evidence that is actually that way.

And yes, greater heals, have better time efficency but, acording to skill description, should have better power-mana efficency, but, has you can see, it doensn't. So, either it description is wrong, or it's not working properly.

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AngeMarkel    14
8 hours ago, PabloC said:

Game mechanics have a logic, that's why they are mechanics and not things that happen. If a game skill power is the double of similar game skill power, in same context results should be double. Since Heal is not affected by rng, I'm providing evidence that is either not working properly or not decribed properly.

Saying that 99% of the skills doesn't make sense is a stament you have made but you don't give any evidence that is actually that way.

And yes, greater heals, have better time efficency but, acording to skill description, should have better power-mana efficency, but, has you can see, it doensn't. So, either it description is wrong, or it's not working properly.

Thats the point..."in same context results should be double"...thats not happen, doesnt matter which skills u compare. Because of the hidden values. There are my 99% comes in again.

For example a flame hawk with 13k power doesnt do the double dmg as a double shot with 6,5k power.

And ur right, descriptions are often wrong too.

 

 

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PabloC    0
5 hours ago, AngeMarkel said:

Thats the point..."in same context results should be double"...thats not happen, doesnt matter which skills u compare. Because of the hidden values. There are my 99% comes in again.

For example a flame hawk with 13k power doesnt do the double dmg as a double shot with 6,5k power.

And ur right, descriptions are often wrong too.

 

 

Yeah, in dmg there are a lot of values that influence total output. Plus, damage is always tied to a RNG that gives out a wide range of damage, not a fixed number. Heals are pretty much straight forward, and there are not supposed to be too much of hidden values. That's why my title is a question: is this working as intented even though is not making sense? is skill power description wrong? I'd like to have access to other l2 classic, like KR PTS or something (or they should do a test server) to see if this works the same way across all classics. Maybe there's something wrong, maybe there is not. I'm just posting my test and calculations that shows that something is not quite as logical expected.

Guess I'll wait for some answer from @Hime, who is very active and polite, or an official word, if I ever get one. Thx for your answer, nevertheless

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PabloC    0
3 hours ago, elari said:

Your calculation is wrong. 

You are not giving a lot of info.

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elari    2

First prof skill given for both: future prophet and bishop.Starting 2nd class transfer one get enhanced heal,which will be leveled more and increase more in power. Don't try to calculate efficiency,pay attention to the power alone.

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PabloC    0
On 18/1/2019 at 2:44 PM, elari said:

First prof skill given for both: future prophet and bishop.Starting 2nd class transfer one get enhanced heal,which will be leveled more and increase more in power. Don't try to calculate efficiency,pay attention to the power alone.

But healing ove power is not consistent, why?. If a healing skills says 100 power, and other one says 200 power, that'd mean that'd heal for double the power. This is not the case. Eficency is more like a consecuence of this problem imo.

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zzzzzzzz    30
On 20.01.2019 г. at 8:42 PM, PabloC said:

But healing ove power is not consistent, why?. If a healing skills says 100 power, and other one says 200 power, that'd mean that'd heal for double the power. This is not the case. Eficency is more like a consecuence of this problem imo.

ofc it wont heal double. it scales with matk ,if u have 0 matk then yeah it will double.

and greater heal IS efficient .Try healing 70 char with pp heal . there is no way u outheal the DPS taken by mobs/chars 70+  with PP heal. just like AngeMarkel said u will need 2 or 3 heals to get the same value.

never judge skills by their base power . they always add the power over the base patk/matk.
 

Edited by zzzzzzzz

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Buldos    14

Elso don't forget that on 42lvl your mana regen is highter then 35lvl and this is makes difference too. Weapons, Tatoos, Character's M.atk all matter all skills powers added to m.atk/p.atk and how it's work only developers know correctly for 100%.

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