Is 14 players clan an exploit in the game ?

[Eyeknot]

15 minutes ago, Divekio said:

And if you have a glass jaw you should watch your mouth... we talk about 14 players clans here and the way they use it as an unfair advantage. What are you talking about ?

there you go again. your talking about ppl are exploting this and that. and that the GMS have to take actions. but what about you? every singel time ppl doesnt agree with you your start theatening them. (you should watch your mouth) , you sit in hero chat saying that everyone should be kind to one and other . and then the next min your starting to being toxic towords everyone. and starting with your threats. if GM's should do anything , it is taking action to you and your dumbass threats to other players

[Divekio]

1 minute ago, Eyeknot said:

there you go again. your talking about ppl are exploting this and that. and that the GMS have to take actions. but what about you? every singel time ppl doesnt agree with you your start theatening them. (you should watch your mouth) , you sit in hero chat saying that everyone should be kind to one and other . and then the next min your starting to being toxic towords everyone. and starting with your threats. if GM's should do anything , it is taking action to you and your dumbass threats to other players

Nobody threaten anyone, stick to the subject toxics . 

[OrcD3vil]

The 14 members in clan is a EXPLOIT simple and plan.  Back when it was changed to this rule NC Soft said it was to stop smaller developing clans from being bullied/griefs.  You have multiple people actively managing the amount of people in a clan to on PURPOSE keep it below the 15 person rule, while engaging in active PVP/Castle Seiges/Blood Swords without having the ability to war them back.  They KEEP it BELOW the number on purpose and do not go over that number.  They knowing and willfully do it, that right there shows intent to bypass a feature of the game for their exploitation.  They shout "Recruiting 108+ X Class" and then put in alt clan or remove someone from main clan to keep numbers under 15 on purpose.  Please look at their shout logs and you can see that I'm telling the truth.  This has been a exploit many clans have used for YEARS, but the jump exploit as you call it has been used FOR YEARS by ALL CLANS and nothing is done unless a mass petition by 5 clans.  5 Clans vs 1 Clan failed to take a castle in which this same very "Exploit" they were banned for several clan members have come on the forums and ADMITTED to them using for YEARS to keep/take castles.  It seems like we have some double standards here being enforced.  NC Soft in 16 yrs of "GMing" this game has NEVER stepped in to take a castle from a clan, but clans using 15 member limit exploiting still have a castle?  The same clan that mass petitioned was using the Force PK to star war SEVERAL times on a PVE clan to grief them into a war, they also infiltrated another clan and force started another war with the force attack macro to be killed 5 times to start that war.  The 5 clans that mass petitioned has been griefing members of clans through extortion "If you don't drop tag and join us we will continue to pk you until you drop tag."  That is very definition of griefing by extortion, but yet when put in ticket GM's "Working as intended"

THIS is a blatant and clear abuse of power in all aspects, one of the offending clans hero's just shouts 24/7 "We beat them, we forced them off the server".  Sorry your bragging you got people banned for the same "exploit" that your clan admitted to using for years.  This is why my subs have been cancelled, I will not purchase more nc coin *not that i did a lot as a disabled veteran* and will no longer play on your servers.  It took 5 clans mass petitioning while EXPLOITING themselves to ruin 2 WHOLE CLANS and get 30+ people banned.  Funny thing is these 5 clans have ruining/harassed 2 Full clans off the server because we are sick of Hypocrite double standards and NC Soft inability to do their job correctly and in a timely fashion.  This post will most likely be deleted because the truth.. it hurts doesn't it.

[Eyeknot]

2 minutes ago, Divekio said:

Nobody threaten anyone, stick to the subject toxics . 

haha bullshit. thats all you do in hero chat, stop lie , everyone knows that. you are the most toxic player that ever has playd l2. and now your acting like you never do anything wrong and that everyone els is toxic or abusing thing. if your now so big and bad then why dont you war the big clans? your scared of waring ms nova and fs. your so pathetic

[OrcD3vil]

50 minutes ago, Aleira said:

just let the topic die... there is no arguing with divekio.  He is too stubborn to see any perspective but his own twisted reality. 

there have been some valid points made, but in the end, it comes down to 1 of 2 things... either bullies being uphappy that they cannot bully as effectively as they wish, or players recently banned and grasping at straws and lashing out at others in an effort to blame others.

Why should the topic just "die"?  Your abusing and exploiting a game mechanic on purpose so you can exp in peace without war along with everything else in game, but you want all the perks of being in seiges/swords.  You exploit the system and now cry about it.  5 clans MASS PETITIONED to get 2 Clans BANNED from game for a "exploit" ALL 5 CLANS USED FOR YEARS.  But when it didn't work to your advantage you petition it, dont' give me this bull "NC Soft said don't do it" because we know all 5 clans involved in MASS petitioning break the TOS/EULA EVERY DAY.  I used to seriously have respect for ProPVE except a few *they know who they are* joked all the time etc, I've been nice, fun, and respectful and I don't break the rules.  But you sit there day in/day out and SLANDER my clannies/ally members, mass petition them for what you 5 clans do, I've been griefed by all 5 clans being in a PVE clan trying to level up.  You have disrespected me at every turn but claim that ONLY MY CLAN DOES THAT.  Stop being a liar, literally you just need to stop giving half truths and lying about so many things.  I've been nice kept quiet and kept my head down, I've had issues with my clan/ally but as a whole there is really some good people in it.  Not saying all 5 clans don't either, but there are bad apples in all clans. STOP lying, STOP telling 1/2 truths, and STOP trying to ban people for the same thing everyone abused for years and years and .. did I say YEARS?  Just like your abusing the 15 person rule, say that your not? Your just lying to yourself maybe you should have 7 day vacation, your castle stripped from you.. Or now people are calling for Armor/Weapons to be taken or levels even?  Ya the thought of that sickens ya doesn't it?  But you want to make others suffer for the same thing everyone has done for years.. This server is so TOXIC the people that play it literally make me sick to my stomach with how rude, evil, cheating, and vindictive.. I love the game but I literally hate all interactions with most people it literally makes me physically sick..  Why are you all so EVIL to other people?? WHY DO YOU WANT TO CAUSE SUCH TERRIBLE HARM TO OTHERS????

[Degus]

I'm not even gonna read the 6 pages of nonsense here.  OP just want to farm low level toons again to see his name flash blue so he feels good about himself.  It's in the rules, how can that be an exploit?  Why are you sending wars to non pvp clans, then trying to force them into full blown war or waste thousands of clan rep to cancel it so everyone in their +6 R99 sets can play for 2 more weeks!   NO way should this even be considered to be looked at.  You want pvp, try not sending war!!!!  Learn to play the game, not just pull out your credit card.  You are scared of real pvp so you send war to clans you know you can wipe forcing them to either not participate in the best part of the game, or suffer terribly for it, ya right, smart request.   War was open and you guys even ran through blazing swamp killing 102+ toons, that's manly alright!! 

[Degus]

2nd thought, man up and dark castle, or stfu

[CryMeARiver]

Just ignore this Trollvekio. they cant accept that they really cheat on siege. What you called that? hhmmm "ButtHurt" rofl

[Divekio]

1 hour ago, Degus said:

2nd thought, man up and dark castle, or stfu

Why would we make dark castles when there are players who just stay in 14 members clan and kill our clan members without us beeing able to war them ? System is out of date and needs to be changed not allow this 14 players clans bully honest players and have unfair advantages in pvp,sieges,swords. 

Edited June 24, 2020 by Divekio

[Degus]

18 minutes ago, Divekio said:

Why would we make dark castles when there are players who just stay in 14 members clan and kill our clan members without us beeing able to war them ? System is out of date and needs to be changed not allow this 14 players clans bully honest players and have unfair advantages in pvp,sieges,swords. 

You aren't really asking that dumb of a question are you?  I'll give ya a few mins to think straight if you need.  And your not actually accusing others of bullying are you?  unfair advantage?  Honest players?   lmfao, dude, just stop!.

[Divekio]

4 minutes ago, Degus said:

You aren't really asking that dumb of a question are you?  I'll give ya a few mins to think straight if you need.  And your not actually accusing others of bullying are you?  unfair advantage?  Honest players?   lmfao, dude, just stop!.

We talk here about 14 player clans who bully others and gain unffair advantage in sieges,swords,pvp . You go lvl , come back talk to me when you wont be 1 shot . Thank you!

Edited June 24, 2020 by Divekio

[Degus]

1 minute ago, Divekio said:

We talk here about 14 player clans who bully others and gain unffair advantage in sieges,swords,pvp . You go lvl , come back talk to me when you wont be 1 shot . Thank you!

point proven, go dark, i dare ya

 

[Degus]

I'm sorry, it slipped my mind, maybe you didn't learn you can pvp without war open ya know, try looking at your screen once in a while.  You 1 shot me in +10 dark set, dont think level will matter, go hide in your light castle and send wars to pve clans, that sounds fun.  Not an exploit, part of the game, play around it, we gotta deal with your sally way of playing, you deal with ours.  Unfair, lawl

 

[pappaPhat]

dive says watch your mouth with glass jaw sounds like a threat but deep down biggest teddy bear ever that just try's to stick up for ms cheating humm and funny thing is they got caught cheating and thats on them. second its not a fault for 14 man clans your mad bc they are pro pve and they just help keep the bullying down from lb ms so go dark castle and stop crying please your nonsense and others that follow the ignorant guy please do yourself a favor and just stop trying to sound right they dont want you in clan simple as that no toxic people in propve no toxic people at all so please stop with your ignorant stuff go drink water get sober

[pappaPhat]

9 minutes ago, Divekio said:

We talk here about 14 player clans who bully others and gain unffair advantage in sieges,swords,pvp . You go lvl , come back talk to me when you wont be 1 shot . Thank you!

what is so unfair dive the fact that you want to bullies afk people in a war just to shout their down when there afk or the fact that your just mad bc you cant fight your own war with people same gear... so food for thought dude go dark please and then stop your crying.

[Degus]

and whats in your clan, 25 alts and 5 live?  no one can stand you, no way those are active people

[Galador]

3 hours ago, Divekio said:

It cannot be abused both ways because PK system changed a lot . Now talking about sieges or swords pvp , while players in clans with 14 + members get war activated by pvp ing in siege and if flagged , the other players in clans under 14 players do not activate war when killing other players so if not flagged one has to PK them when they move from safe zone to pvp area , where they can kill other players without war starting for them . This system is unfair at this moment and doesnt apply to the game as curently is .

If I interpret what you are trying to say, you're upset because you can't force a war to keep from paying a penalty for PKing other players?  Let's set aside who they are for the moment and go through this step by step.  I know of no rule, other than level caps, that stops one player from killing another player whenever they want.  That's called PKing.  If the other player can't or doesn't respond, the attacker can go red.   If the attacked chooses to engage, they can go pink and are fair game.  So far so good?  Now, a clan can declare war on another clan at any time.  If not accepted, the cost of dying is 100% death penalty.  If accepted by killing 5 players, XP loss is 25% of death penalty.  So it seems that it's in the best interest of the attacker to get the other clan to accept.  How am I doing so far?  During a siege, both registered and non-registered players can lose XP if they die on the siege field.  If you enter, then leave the siege field, you can go pink upon exit and be killed without penalty.  You don't have to register to come on a siege field, but normal PVP rules apply.  High level players who are registered to attack or defend a castle have been showing up at sieges for as along as I've played this game.  So if I've gotten all that right, the only conclusion I can come to is that you're upset that you can't force another clan to accept a war and thereby reduce the XP cost in PVP.  What am I missing?  Oh, it's also been my observation that those who enjoy PKing also love to find ways to do so without it costing them anything. 

Edited June 24, 2020 by Galador
typo

[Degus]

I think he passed out bro, he'll forget it all tomorrow.

[Gem]

There is also another topic that discusses War System in general, and some interesting proposals are given there. But you all do not want to engage in a normal civilized discussion, and you keep on pushing your agendas by using means of propaganda and spamming. Asking to change just the 14 people rule without overhauling the entire war system is just that.

This topic is toxic like the most of "discussions" held on our server.

p.s. I see many bullies here that should keep their voice down when talking about other people being bullies or grievers.

[Afum]

People exploiting it to take an advantage in war, they should be 7 days banned and taken clan hall from them, if u wanna be fair with all ppl just ban all ppl who exploit things not just enemy of your (GMs) friends

 

[Moto]

Not too long ago, in the past when a xp event's came up didn't MS and LB drop clan to go to other clan's to avoid wars. So really in all reality they are just doing the same thing but a 14 man clan is winning against at least a 42+ man clan, then something must be wrong on ur end.

[Gonein60Seconds]

I made a ticket to support earlier today asking in a nutshell if my clan is allowed to pvp in a pvp game... i swear to all i hold dear if they tell me we are exploiting, we will stop fighting in a 14 man clan. If they decided to punish us, we will take the punishment, learn from it and not cry or goto core. we are adults we will self reflect. that being said i am 100% we are not exploiting. you guys just want blood, for the wrong you did. I too feel you guys got harsh punishment, but noone on the server has the power to influence supports decisions they gave you guys the harsh punishment not anyone else. there are no GM's in peoples pockets, no matter how many times you say it, doesnt make it true. they came down super hard because of the warning they posted before. 

[n00dl3s]

Is 14 players clan an exploit in the game ?

 

no. working as intended.
I'm pretty sure devs didn't dropped something on the keyboard and that feature was added. its there for a good reason.
don't cry on forums.

[Degus]

Declaring a war

1. A clan level 5 or above consisting of at least15 characters can declare a war to another clan. To accept that war, the second clan should also meet the same requirements.
2. At the same time a clan can challenge up to 30 clans, but it can accept any amount of challenges.
3. You can declare a war using a chat command or clan management interface.
4. The clan someone declared war against can use their clan information window to see the info about clan wars, like how many times their clan members were killed and the time before declining the challenge before the war has begun.
5. War begins when the clan someone declared war against:
   • accepted it by pressing a special button in their clan management menu;
   • killed in PvP/PK 5 or more characters from the clan who's declared war (the opponents should not be in a chaotic state);
   • if a character dies from reflected damage, such death is not eligible for death counter to start a clan war;
   • death is eligible for such counter if the clan someone declared war against has delivered the lethal blow on that character; or it has don 90% of the damage. However, if someone unrelated to the war has delivered the final blow, such death doesn't count.
   •  

[oscar2132]

6 minutes ago, Degus said:

Declaring a war

1. A clan level 5 or above consisting of at least15 characters can declare a war to another clan. To accept that war, the second clan should also meet the same requirements.
2. At the same time a clan can challenge up to 30 clans, but it can accept any amount of challenges.
3. You can declare a war using a chat command or clan management interface.
4. The clan someone declared war against can use their clan information window to see the info about clan wars, like how many times their clan members were killed and the time before declining the challenge before the war has begun.
5. War begins when the clan someone declared war against:
   • accepted it by pressing a special button in their clan management menu;
   • killed in PvP/PK 5 or more characters from the clan who's declared war (the opponents should not be in a chaotic state);
   • if a character dies from reflected damage, such death is not eligible for death counter to start a clan war;
   • death is eligible for such counter if the clan someone declared war against has delivered the lethal blow on that character; or it has don 90% of the damage. However, if someone unrelated to the war has delivered the final blow, such death doesn't count.
   •  

this is a rule as old as the game, 16 years ? many things changed in the mean time like macro hunting and pk system, it's time for clan war rules tu be updated also, protecting both parts, those who want pve and those who want pvp, makeing it clear and transparent for all, no place for cheating !!! and then there will be no cheat !!! at this moment a clan that avoid war can attend to siege and get a castle, this is exploit, as clear as day light!