Fix clan war system

[wari]

The current clan war system is a total joke.  It allows anyone to find an aoe macro on a tyrr who wants to use their skills, and trigger 5 kills on an afk.  

The current scenario in my bigger clan of 60+ actives is on a weekly basis some clan finds any tyrr afking, and starts war vs us,  we cannot end it until all clan members are out of combat or offline.  Meanwhile we have no way to defend against this unless we drop to multiple 14 man clans.

Most bigger clans are in perma 14 man clans because of this.  It is just really sad that this is the system.  Today it is my clan, tomorrow it will be yours.  It is a huge problem that needs to be solved.

We need to either allow us to cancel wars any time (regardless of clan members are in combat) or we need to fix the way a war starts.  

Thanks

[Rodah]

+1 

While I know it's not a technical exploit, it allows people to abuse a flawed game design to continually harass any clan that aspires to be... an actual clan (more than 14 people).

[Anything]

I agree with that it's not a healthy development at all that all big clans are starting to crumble down to 14 people clans just to avoid constant re-triggered war abuse.

The mechanic needs to be changed to prevent abuse, even a grace period will not help because the offender could just switch to another clan and repeat the process.
Sad to say but looks like this may become the next system that may get removed entirely just like Greedy Treasure Chests and countless other things solely because of all this abuse on these servers...

[Catlord]

The war system is used to stop pvp by declaring on anyone to stop them from fighting back. Wars have turned from a pvp feature to lets waste the other side's runes and pots by killing them while they are asleep. How about we get the actual choice to accept war declarations instead of this afk tyrr=war crap?

[iHyperlite]

current system is broken. everyone detags to join a 14- man clan the second siege ends, only to retag sat/sun before the next siege.  totally stupid.

[Helvie]

+1 to that, in addition to what others said, since NC Soft admitted they were not able to secure afk farm against exploiting PK drop and removed the drop on PK (which is sad as I'd prefer that they fixed the possibility of forcing players to go red) then they should also address the clan war scam issue.

[wari]

bump i've had literally 4 wars started this week against my clan.. time for 14 mans...

[iHyperlite]

This would have to come from Korea. Even if our region requested it, I have little hope for this to change

[Mitzza]

+1 the war should start only if clan leader accept , or some members who have the right accept, not after 5 kills , hapend also to me, did not even know who ore when the  war started exactly, it was during on event when you have to kill mobs to get event items, but becuse of the war no one from clan could farm and stayed in towns until the war ended.

[Caballeros]

The system is completely old, now broken, abusables and lamerable....

BECAUSE THIS WAR SYSTEM WAS NOT TOUGHT INTO A AFK MACRO SYSTEM GAME....

by the tryck u get flag u put ur toon under ppl afk macro, repeat 5times and bam, war triggered by LAMERING.

 

DEVELOPERS SHOULD WORK AND IMPROVE SERIOUSLY THEIR GAME TO WHAT NEED AND WHAT NOT, NOT ONLY TAKE MONEYS BY GAMBLING EVENTS ONLY.

[Degus]

Tell your idiot clannies to learn how to set up their macros, we all have skills that can flag us afk, if you chooses to use them anyways, well, other people wanna have fun too, it's not all the systems fault!

[Anything]

2 hours ago, Degus said:

Tell your idiot clannies to learn how to set up their macros, we all have skills that can flag us afk, if you chooses to use them anyways, well, other people wanna have fun too, it's not all the systems fault!

This would have been a nice advice if you had not resolved to name calling.

I got told off for repeatedly PK'ing specific people from a enemy clan, when i was not allowed to do that i resorted to triggering wars with their clan and again got told off for doing that as well.
I do get that doing it for 20-30 times against the same clan or person is considered abusive at best harassment at worst but they just get back at them what they were doing to me in the first place!

@Hime @Juji @LIME Currently people are held to 2 standards, some can do this and some can't.
Why does a difference like this even exist?
Do you have any kind of input about this?
How are you going to streamline it so that we all get the same answer, regardless of clan or person asking.

As to the main topic for this and the root of the problem mostly.
Some classes sadly are more screwed then others, those being:
- Archer is the least screwed because their most powerful skills work with a target and are thus not at risk.
- Feoh can't use snares but their targeted aoe's are fine to use and are still relatively strong without loosing too much.
- Tyrr are just completely screwed if not on melee/one by one attacks because many of their aoe attacks are without target and therefor they lack the biggest contribution in damage from those.
Dreads from all Tyrr are probably worst off with this since they really lack damage when not doing aoe damage.

Few ideas to semi fix the issue without touching war system:
- A toggle so skills that do not require a target now will require it to cast.
- Let aoe skills honor your next target setting (hit only monsters if set on monster only).
The 2nd option would completely open up these players to PK without even doing any damage to the PK'er as a trade off.

[Degus]

I said that cuz I know the clan and I know most of them are NOT idiots.  Maybe all those toons that turned tyrr should of thought about this ahead of time!   I really don't expect them to change the system seeing sooooo many already learned when and when not to use those skills.   If the same person does it more then once, kick them, 20-30 times, I'd start pk'ing them too if I was you.   Or you have an enemy in your clan doing it on purpose. 

[iHyperlite]

3 hours ago, Anything said:

This would have been a nice advice if you had not resolved to name calling.

I got told off for repeatedly PK'ing specific people from a enemy clan, when i was not allowed to do that i resorted to triggering wars with their clan and again got told off for doing that as well.
I do get that doing it for 20-30 times against the same clan or person is considered abusive at best harassment at worst but they just get back at them what they were doing to me in the first place!

@Hime @Juji @LIME Currently people are held to 2 standards, some can do this and some can't.
Why does a difference like this even exist?
Do you have any kind of input about this?
How are you going to streamline it so that we all get the same answer, regardless of clan or person asking.

As to the main topic for this and the root of the problem mostly.
Some classes sadly are more screwed then others, those being:
- Archer is the least screwed because their most powerful skills work with a target and are thus not at risk.
- Feoh can't use snares but their targeted aoe's are fine to use and are still relatively strong without loosing too much.
- Tyrr are just completely screwed if not on melee/one by one attacks because many of their aoe attacks are without target and therefor they lack the biggest contribution in damage from those.
Dreads from all Tyrr are probably worst off with this since they really lack damage when not doing aoe damage.

Few ideas to semi fix the issue without touching war system:
- A toggle so skills that do not require a target now will require it to cast.
- Let aoe skills honor your next target setting (hit only monsters if set on monster only).
The 2nd option would completely open up these players to PK without even doing any damage to the PK'er as a trade off.

 

ToA on naia was a pve clan that had ppl trying to start wars all the time on us.  We actively told members what skills to not use, reminded them to set target to monster, and actively closed wars after each maint.  if we had a problem member who always was the culprit, we eventually figured it out and kicked them.

 

im not disagreeing that the current system is a pain in the ass for this.  but many of these inadvertent wars can be prevented by members who listen and follow directions.

[Mitzza]

Is very hard to control a 68 people clan , there will always be that clan member that do not listen or does not understaned, or just joind clan to start war.

If you leave the car window open and the phone on the seat , the phone will be stolen, who will you blame? Everyone, the one who stole the phone , the car, the phone, the town, daylight saiving. Some one will always leave a phone in the car, the wife the kides, so closing the car windous will be a good thing to do, in the game the car has no windows so you have to take care of the members of clan.

[Boil]

War system  is not broken just because you guys can't grow up your clans and chars in auto afk mode like tamagotchi. There is PVP, war and other things which make the game not really boring. If you don't like it don't play it. Simple.  War system is ok I think. Just big clan is not flexible. I am happy with that the rules still don't depend on auto afk mode.

[SpazzyYazzy]

imagine have 10 of the same clan members whine in a forum post about clan war makes sense

[Anything]

13 hours ago, Degus said:

I said that cuz I know the clan and I know most of them are NOT idiots.  Maybe all those toons that turned tyrr should of thought about this ahead of time!   I really don't expect them to change the system seeing sooooo many already learned when and when not to use those skills.   If the same person does it more then once, kick them, 20-30 times, I'd start pk'ing them too if I was you.   Or you have an enemy in your clan doing it on purpose. 

I don't pretend to know many of their clan members but i do know some of them, which were already tyrr/dread before red libra and they been that class for long time.
As for who is causing it, no idea they are not my clan so not much i can do about that other then a bit of feedback here.

[Rodah]

14 hours ago, Boil said:

War system  is not broken just because you guys can't grow up your clans and chars in auto afk mode like tamagotchi. There is PVP, war and other things which make the game not really boring. If you don't like it don't play it. Simple.  War system is ok I think. Just big clan is not flexible. I am happy with that the rules still don't depend on auto afk mode.

Yeah; war system is fine.  It's not like all the top clans on Chronos are 14 members or anything...... wait, what??

[Degus]

11 minutes ago, Rodah said:

Yeah; war system is fine.  It's not like all the top clans on Chronos are 14 members or anything...... wait, what??

who cares how many in clan, they also aren't flagging on randoms and dying to pvp while afk cuz they don't know how to set up a proper macro. 

[Rodah]

1 hour ago, Degus said:

who cares how many in clan, they also aren't flagging on randoms and dying to pvp while afk cuz they don't know how to set up a proper macro. 

OK, just so we are clear; the situation is a supposedly "PvP" clan is keeping perma war declared on a PvE clan.  Because no one is perfect and/or people want to XP/farm as efficiently as possible, this so called PvP clan is able to trigger an unwanted war more often than not.  Meanwhile, the real PvP clans on Chronos are staying under 14 members so they don't even have to mess with this nonsense.  

.... and your advice to the PvE clan is to dismiss members and/or tell Tyrrs to operate at 50% efficiancy?  Really??  That is just messed up.  Are you just being a contrarian out of spit?  Why not join with the rest of us and say "yeah, it's a flawed system?"  This is especially ironic considering you are in an under 14 man clan in an ally with two other >14 clans. 

EDIT:  And just so we are crystal clear, a Tyrrs absolute strongest skill will trigger a war.  I mean how would you feel if you couldn't use Multi-Shot because some jerks just wanted to score easy kills and grief you and your clan??

 

[Degus]

13 hours ago, SpazzyYazzy said:

imagine have 10 of the same clan members whine in a forum post about clan war makes sense

ya, they are bringing probably unwelcome attention to themselves, all this crying is gonna make them and others grief ya more!  Until there is a change, learn to deal or come back later i guess, that's what the rest of the server is doing. 

[Boil]

Guys, if I understand rightly easy afk in auto farm mode is the most important thing in the game for you. That's really funy. Even GMs don't  recommend it. I do it, you  do it if you want, but don't be surprised in the next morning. Don't try to brake the game completely by pushing everyone to take care of  your tamagotchi style.

Have fun!

[Degus]

There's always fishing

[Catlord]

On 5/24/2021 at 10:52 PM, Degus said:

I said that cuz I know the clan and I know most of them are NOT idiots.  Maybe all those toons that turned tyrr should of thought about this ahead of time!   I really don't expect them to change the system seeing sooooo many already learned when and when not to use those skills.   If the same person does it more then once, kick them, 20-30 times, I'd start pk'ing them too if I was you.   Or you have an enemy in your clan doing it on purpose. 

Tyrrs get screwed one way or the other it seems. For the past couple of years it was either have a skill setup or pretend to pve with varying degrees of melee lag. Now y'alls are like "eh, just don't use skills. No more melee lag, right?"

4 hours ago, Boil said:

Guys, if I understand rightly easy afk in auto farm mode is the most important thing in the game for you. That's really funy. Even GMs don't  recommend it. I do it, you  do it if you want, but don't be surprised in the next morning. Don't try to brake the game completely by pushing everyone to take care of  your tamagotchi style.

Have fun!

I'd be more inclined to play somewhat live if the content updates wasn't just raising the levels on the same stuff I've been doing for the better part of a decade and I most definitely won't endlessly grind by hand to level up. You do you though.