A open talk about the current server situation

[Kaizant]

Hey there guys, first of all i want to say that i'm NOT whiteknighting here, just explaim my thought process, and that now days i can be put in the casual, with that out the way, let me start

 

Adena

I dont really have a problem, right now, with the adena droping but for what i saw in the foruns i will probally(?) have. Yes, i'm under 40 cause i dont have enought time to play, nor i want to rush for the end game. Back in 2004, we were 4 players that started toguether, and soon we had 2 more in our party/clan. You had to spend around 14~18h to lvl a char from 1 to 20 and change your class. I was 20, and working, had just 4~6h play per day, and took 2 or 3 days to have the first class transfer quest. So you spent more time farming and doing quests to get money.

The shots under lvl 20, were a luxury, and every weapon consumed multiples shots. the early were 2x (i think were x4 for bows). Right now, the weapons cost 1 shot per attack (including bows), so your cost went down by at least half. that said, i can understand less adena to not inflate the economy... and yes, the first week were shit, even with the cost reduced, you couldnt aford shots.

My firts char was in giran and was a elf to become a tank, i hit 20 and was stuck... so i did what we did (my friends and I) back in 2004, i made a dwarf, made 2 to be more especific (inthe same acc as my tanker), a crafter and a spoiler. Did the quest to get the weapon with both and started to do repeateble quests, not the spider quest, there were 3 quests that could be done in the same area and by the end of that run, by quest alone, i would earn 7.3k+random. With this i got the TOP NG armor set, and shared with all 3 chars. 

That was at the shitest week of the server.

I'm still rolling 3 characters now, and sharing every thing. Right now i'm farming my D grade weapons.

I'm not saying the current drop is OK, cause by what i read, after 40 its really not

 

Queue

I cant tell much about it cause i'm a solo player, and the day i spent 3h of the 4h i have in the morning before go to work trying to log during a week day, i gave up on giran and move to aden. As i said, today i'm a solo player with very little time, and didnt have friends with me to hold me down on that server, nor i bought the launch pack. I really feel for you guys who want to change server but cant for whatever reason. I wish it could be fix.

That said... i had to do all that little tale for money again...

 

Spoil/drops

Yeah... thats the real issue in my opinion... i can get around less adena cause i play around the system and have no desire to rush the game. but the spoil is something that really annoys me.

I just finish to farm 150 animal bones for my trident. I checked on EU wiki to see a mob in my lvl range and went there, and yes i know that the rates are diferents. The EU server is supose to be 1x and we are not.

The mob was suposse to have 70% chance to give me 1 animal bone meaning of 2 of 3 mobs would get me 1 animal bone... i reality i got 1 out of 5~6 mobs... around 20%... its doable, no bigie... YET!

As i said before, i get it why we have less adena... less shots to consume, no gk fees before 40, weapon/armor NG, and armor D grade.. But why nerf the drops and spoil??? Oh! to force people to spend money on VIP and L2shop?

I have no problem to spend my money in something i like, and my hobby is gaming. I spend money in almost all mmo that i played, an i would do gladly as long its fair... Warframe, Guildwars 2, Final Fantasy 14, League of legends, Starcraft 2, Tree of savior, just to name a few.

If you dont have adena form mobs, you need the 1x drops to compasate it. Trash drops would be sold to npc to generate adena, the mats would fuel dwarfs and so on...

 

Thas my real problem... VIP should be a "luxury" not a "necessity" to play. 

 

Well... guess that was it.

ps: Plz, dont start the "if you dont lilke, quit it kid", cause you only hurting the game population. I will continue to play 3 chars, do things not caring if i'm at the top or whatever you want to do, i'm just voicing a opinion.

 

 

[Shreekz]

I totally understand that many people see the spoil rates as an issue. I currently have a scavvy but Im reluctant to play it for that reason. HOWEVER, I am a firm believer that if you want something to change, you need to clearly present what the problem is and suggest reasonable solutions. So your arguing that the mob had a 70% chance to give you animal bone, yeah? Im sorry but that does not mean 2 of 3 mobs will yield you one. That is not how probability works. Each individual mob has a 70% chance of giving you 1 (if these rates are correct on NA) so as you increase your mobs killed, it should slowly even out to that percentage, but your sample size is so small it proves nothing. 

 

To all the posts that will follow yelling and screaming that its 'obvious there is a problem, fix it!' you guys are exactly what im talking about. Provide evidence that its messed up, dont just shout at the devs to fix it.

[Devoid]

1 minute ago, Shreekz said:

but your sample size is so small it proves nothing.

150 bones is a pretty decent sample size for testing 70% rate. It would start getting small for rates below 10%

[Kaizant]

11 minutes ago, Shreekz said:

To all the posts that will follow yelling and screaming that its 'obvious there is a problem, fix it!' you guys are exactly what im talking about. Provide evidence that its messed up, dont just shout at the devs to fix it.

Ok.. i think i didnt express myself in the right way since you missunderstud me, or i am missunderstanding you.

I did say that i'm rolling 3 chars and have no rush in this game, and i'm pretty sure that for someone who intencionally killed his chars to stay in the lvl range to spoil back in the day, and will do pretty soon since my spoiler is getting to high to spoil a recipe i need. I enjoy have to grind! For me L2 was my favorite MMORPG cause for you to get strong, you had to work for it. I'm not trying to offend WoW players, but cause many casual (to mmorpgs) for the RTS community went play WoW (warcraft was a RTS before that, and i played it a lot) Blizzard tunned down the grind cause the community cried for it.

Yes, i know that each mob have an individual chance to spoil, and when i said 2 of 3 mob SHOULD in a 1x rate, and we are not on 1x rate. Do you understand that what i said was about the expected metric?

Again, i'm not "yelling" to change the rates, since i agree with less adena since we have less to spend in early the early game. I dont remember what/who post said (unfortunally i have no time to look right now) that we dont know our own rate, a wiki would help a lot! I would never complain if i was aware thet the 70%ish mob from EU server is only 20%ish here. I'm playing here not there, but i'm forced to check there for a semi blind guidance.

 

Quote

 but your sample size is so small it proves nothing. 

I spend the entire morning on this (about 3 and half hours) and i put the "general" killing by 5~6 mobs for 1 bone. Again, not complaining about spend 3:30h there, i did what i set to do, i'm good, the issue is that we dont know the rate, and for a 70%ish to become 20%ish is concerning for those sweets 0.0001% in high lvls.

Yeah, that was times that i got 2 mobs in a row, even 3, but also those that i went about 10 min without 1 mob. So... using the 5~6 mob per animal bone i would say that i killed 750~900 mobs. The same amount that i would kill near imperial tomb for the thrid class quest.

Again, not complaining about the time or the grind, but the vip system (wich ironically dont affect the spoil rates) been shoved on us, with the silver coins, shots (for C grades and above looks like the first week by the "cry") and shit rates for f2p players.

Also, you do realise that they give you extra exp so you will out lvl your wealth to spend those NCcoins, or do what i did/will do: intencinally die to the city guard to be able to get your equip.

 

Thas not my first rodeo with ncsoft, thats why i didnt went for the launch pack. I'm from a time before f2p model both on aion and L2. Do you know of warframe? a game that is f2p, with a insane amount of grind, and with a fair cash shop. I'm more than happy to buy platinum there, even if i do not spend on the frames/weapons/pets, hell even the cosmetics dont fill my eyes, but i buy caus e the game is good (with a lot of flaws) and DE tried to do right by the community.

 

Well... off to work, cu mates

[Shreekz]

Wasn't bashing you, I could just see this thread turning into another argument over something with little/no evidence that I wanted to best everyone to the punch. The data that you said in your 2nd post is what the devs need to hear is all I'm saying to you. Tell them what you got off of 750 mobs not 2-3. That gives them a better picture of what the rates really are and if it reflects what they put in the coding 

[Revan]

34 minutes ago, Shreekz said:

Wasn't bashing you, I could just see this thread turning into another argument over something with little/no evidence that I wanted to best everyone to the punch. The data that you said in your 2nd post is what the devs need to hear is all I'm saying to you. Tell them what you got off of 750 mobs not 2-3. That gives them a better picture of what the rates really are and if it reflects what they put in the coding 

Dude, you are being riddiculous. We have to give the devs a better picture of what the rates are? By this claim you are suggesting, that they launched new servers and they don't know by themselves what rates did they set on them? Hilarious. They exactly know what they did, and they are doing it on purpose. And that purpose is greed. Wait a month of two - if nothing changes and thigs will stay as they are, their classic servers will be just ghost towns. Maybe then, when they will no longer have any income, because noone wants to play on a broken and unfair server, will they finally realize their mistake. But in a month or two, it is just going to be too late. More and more people are already leaving with each passing day without their response. So either they quickly do something reasonable, and listen to their player base for once, or the servers are just going to die off along with their potential money. Soo... @Juji @Hime - the clock is ticking.

[Shakedown]

I'm not sure why you're having such a problem with spoils. It's really not that bad...

[Missa]

9 minutes ago, Shakedown said:

I'm not sure why you're having such a problem with spoils. It's really not that bad...

While u need 10 steel to create items, ofc it is not that bad, but later on u need 1k animals bone...  You will be able only to take 1 from spoil. Have fun.

[Shakedown]

1 minute ago, Missa said:

While u need 10 steel to create items, ofc it is not that bad, but later on u need 1k animals bone...  You will be able only to take 1 from spoil. Have fun.

I spoil ~200 in a day no problem. I can wait 5 days of farming to craft my item. It is supposed to be this way.

[Rck]

5 hours ago, Kaizant said:

... there were 3 quests that could be done in the same area and by the end of that run, by quest alone, i would earn 7.3k+random.

 

 

 

Hey, I know this is off topic, but do you mind sharing this run? I’m still in early lvls. 

[IceAge]

@Kaizant you still didn't say your level.

We all know that in lower level's the adena and spoil is .. decent at max. The problem starts above 30+ , especially after 40.

[beleaua]

6 hours ago, Kaizant said:

Adena

I dont really have a problem, right now, with the adena droping but for what i saw in the foruns i will probally(?) have. Yes, i'm under 40 cause i dont have enought time to play, nor i want to rush for the end game. Back in 2004, we were 4 players that started toguether, and soon we had 2 more in our party/clan. You had to spend around 14~18h to lvl a char from 1 to 20 and change your class. I was 20, and working, had just 4~6h play per day, and took 2 or 3 days to have the first class transfer quest. So you spent more time farming and doing quests to get money.

The shots under lvl 20, were a luxury, and every weapon consumed multiples shots. the early were 2x (i think were x4 for bows). Right now, the weapons cost 1 shot per attack (including bows), so your cost went down by at least half. that said, i can understand less adena to not inflate the economy... and yes, the first week were shit, even with the cost reduced, you couldnt aford shots.

My firts char was in giran and was a elf to become a tank, i hit 20 and was stuck... so i did what we did (my friends and I) back in 2004, i made a dwarf, made 2 to be more especific (inthe same acc as my tanker), a crafter and a spoiler. Did the quest to get the weapon with both and started to do repeateble quests, not the spider quest, there were 3 quests that could be done in the same area and by the end of that run, by quest alone, i would earn 7.3k+random. With this i got the TOP NG armor set, and shared with all 3 chars. 

That was at the shitest week of the server.

I'm still rolling 3 characters now, and sharing every thing. Right now i'm farming my D grade weapons.

I'm not saying the current drop is OK, cause by what i read, after 40 its really not

now reading this, i'm wondering why people compare this to 2004? replace the year with late 2005, when we had c4, and the situation is totally different. everything was a lot more easier for many years, a few times more easier than the current eu (skelth) server. from 2004 to 2005 is just a year, from 2005 to 2011 (god patch)  it's a lot more years.

even the beginning is proved (with the prima guide) to have more adena drops than now.

now i'm not against people liking harder content, some are masochists like that. but i'm against people comparing, telling it was harder back then when it was not. it's just that people now have accumulated all that experience from the past and put it to good use now, while in the past  we were just admiring the environment for days doing nothing in the game. in the past it was all a journey, an adventure, nobody knew what to do. today we went straight to being efficient and skipped all that.

[Kokusho]

7 hours ago, Kaizant said:

Hey there guys, first of all i want to say that i'm NOT whiteknighting here, just explaim my thought process, and that now days i can be put in the casual, with that out the way, let me start

 

Adena

I dont really have a problem, right now, with the adena droping but for what i saw in the foruns i will probally(?) have. Yes, i'm under 40 cause i dont have enought time to play, nor i want to rush for the end game. Back in 2004, we were 4 players that started toguether, and soon we had 2 more in our party/clan. You had to spend around 14~18h to lvl a char from 1 to 20 and change your class. I was 20, and working, had just 4~6h play per day, and took 2 or 3 days to have the first class transfer quest. So you spent more time farming and doing quests to get money.

The shots under lvl 20, were a luxury, and every weapon consumed multiples shots. the early were 2x (i think were x4 for bows). Right now, the weapons cost 1 shot per attack (including bows), so your cost went down by at least half. that said, i can understand less adena to not inflate the economy... and yes, the first week were shit, even with the cost reduced, you couldnt aford shots.

My firts char was in giran and was a elf to become a tank, i hit 20 and was stuck... so i did what we did (my friends and I) back in 2004, i made a dwarf, made 2 to be more especific (inthe same acc as my tanker), a crafter and a spoiler. Did the quest to get the weapon with both and started to do repeateble quests, not the spider quest, there were 3 quests that could be done in the same area and by the end of that run, by quest alone, i would earn 7.3k+random. With this i got the TOP NG armor set, and shared with all 3 chars. 

That was at the shitest week of the server.

I'm still rolling 3 characters now, and sharing every thing. Right now i'm farming my D grade weapons.

I'm not saying the current drop is OK, cause by what i read, after 40 its really not

 

Queue

I cant tell much about it cause i'm a solo player, and the day i spent 3h of the 4h i have in the morning before go to work trying to log during a week day, i gave up on giran and move to aden. As i said, today i'm a solo player with very little time, and didnt have friends with me to hold me down on that server, nor i bought the launch pack. I really feel for you guys who want to change server but cant for whatever reason. I wish it could be fix.

That said... i had to do all that little tale for money again...

 

Spoil/drops

Yeah... thats the real issue in my opinion... i can get around less adena cause i play around the system and have no desire to rush the game. but the spoil is something that really annoys me.

I just finish to farm 150 animal bones for my trident. I checked on EU wiki to see a mob in my lvl range and went there, and yes i know that the rates are diferents. The EU server is supose to be 1x and we are not.

The mob was suposse to have 70% chance to give me 1 animal bone meaning of 2 of 3 mobs would get me 1 animal bone... i reality i got 1 out of 5~6 mobs... around 20%... its doable, no bigie... YET!

As i said before, i get it why we have less adena... less shots to consume, no gk fees before 40, weapon/armor NG, and armor D grade.. But why nerf the drops and spoil??? Oh! to force people to spend money on VIP and L2shop?

I have no problem to spend my money in something i like, and my hobby is gaming. I spend money in almost all mmo that i played, an i would do gladly as long its fair... Warframe, Guildwars 2, Final Fantasy 14, League of legends, Starcraft 2, Tree of savior, just to name a few.

If you dont have adena form mobs, you need the 1x drops to compasate it. Trash drops would be sold to npc to generate adena, the mats would fuel dwarfs and so on...

 

Thas my real problem... VIP should be a "luxury" not a "necessity" to play. 

 

Well... guess that was it.

ps: Plz, dont start the "if you dont lilke, quit it kid", cause you only hurting the game population. I will continue to play 3 chars, do things not caring if i'm at the top or whatever you want to do, i'm just voicing a opinion.

 

 

This is mordeo's spoil rate and quantity at skelth:

Animal Bone

1 — 17

73.76% — 90.76%

 

Here you get 1 animal bone in each 2-3 of them you kill.

[kupuldog]

8 hours ago, Kaizant said:

Hey there guys, first of all i want to say that i'm NOT whiteknighting here, just explaim my thought process, and that now days i can be put in the casual, with that out the way, let me start

 

Adena

I dont really have a problem, right now, with the adena droping but for what i saw in the foruns i will probally(?) have. Yes, i'm under 40 cause i dont have enought time to play, nor i want to rush for the end game. Back in 2004, we were 4 players that started toguether, and soon we had 2 more in our party/clan. You had to spend around 14~18h to lvl a char from 1 to 20 and change your class. I was 20, and working, had just 4~6h play per day, and took 2 or 3 days to have the first class transfer quest. So you spent more time farming and doing quests to get money.

The shots under lvl 20, were a luxury, and every weapon consumed multiples shots. the early were 2x (i think were x4 for bows). Right now, the weapons cost 1 shot per attack (including bows), so your cost went down by at least half. that said, i can understand less adena to not inflate the economy... and yes, the first week were shit, even with the cost reduced, you couldnt aford shots.

My firts char was in giran and was a elf to become a tank, i hit 20 and was stuck... so i did what we did (my friends and I) back in 2004, i made a dwarf, made 2 to be more especific (inthe same acc as my tanker), a crafter and a spoiler. Did the quest to get the weapon with both and started to do repeateble quests, not the spider quest, there were 3 quests that could be done in the same area and by the end of that run, by quest alone, i would earn 7.3k+random. With this i got the TOP NG armor set, and shared with all 3 chars. 

That was at the shitest week of the server.

I'm still rolling 3 characters now, and sharing every thing. Right now i'm farming my D grade weapons.

I'm not saying the current drop is OK, cause by what i read, after 40 its really not

 

Queue

I cant tell much about it cause i'm a solo player, and the day i spent 3h of the 4h i have in the morning before go to work trying to log during a week day, i gave up on giran and move to aden. As i said, today i'm a solo player with very little time, and didnt have friends with me to hold me down on that server, nor i bought the launch pack. I really feel for you guys who want to change server but cant for whatever reason. I wish it could be fix.

That said... i had to do all that little tale for money again...

 

Spoil/drops

Yeah... thats the real issue in my opinion... i can get around less adena cause i play around the system and have no desire to rush the game. but the spoil is something that really annoys me.

I just finish to farm 150 animal bones for my trident. I checked on EU wiki to see a mob in my lvl range and went there, and yes i know that the rates are diferents. The EU server is supose to be 1x and we are not.

The mob was suposse to have 70% chance to give me 1 animal bone meaning of 2 of 3 mobs would get me 1 animal bone... i reality i got 1 out of 5~6 mobs... around 20%... its doable, no bigie... YET!

As i said before, i get it why we have less adena... less shots to consume, no gk fees before 40, weapon/armor NG, and armor D grade.. But why nerf the drops and spoil??? Oh! to force people to spend money on VIP and L2shop?

I have no problem to spend my money in something i like, and my hobby is gaming. I spend money in almost all mmo that i played, an i would do gladly as long its fair... Warframe, Guildwars 2, Final Fantasy 14, League of legends, Starcraft 2, Tree of savior, just to name a few.

If you dont have adena form mobs, you need the 1x drops to compasate it. Trash drops would be sold to npc to generate adena, the mats would fuel dwarfs and so on...

 

Thas my real problem... VIP should be a "luxury" not a "necessity" to play. 

 

Well... guess that was it.

ps: Plz, dont start the "if you dont lilke, quit it kid", cause you only hurting the game population. I will continue to play 3 chars, do things not caring if i'm at the top or whatever you want to do, i'm just voicing a opinion.

 

 

Come to spider nest, 11 spoilers in total. 8 on bot. Just met the guy who's having SE 30+ level which I recorded and reported 2 weeks ago. Se nick name empower25, first week of the server 3 empower were farming non stop on bot in spider nest, now he's leveling his main. Glhf playing in boting paradise. 

[beleaua]

35 minutes ago, Kokusho said:

This is mordeo's spoil rate and quantity at skelth:

Animal Bone

1 — 17

73.76% — 90.76%

 

Here you get 1 animal bone in each 2-3 of them you kill.

even when the chance is lower, i found that the quantity is set to 1 for most things

relevant post: https://forums.lineage2.com/topic/6191-whats-up-with-46lv-mobs-and-147-adena/?do=findComment&comment=50209

[Kaizant]

7 hours ago, Shakedown said:

I spoil ~200 in a day no problem. I can wait 5 days of farming to craft my item. It is supposed to be this way.

Neither do i have problem with spend more than 1 day to craft, clarifying what is my concern: we do not have a data base to be sure what our rates are. I'm all in for "hardecore farm", but i would like to be informed of that first. People are claiming that we already had a ninja nerf for higher lvls (40+). 

I cracked my head open in the first week to make money when we had no drops, and already had started try to get some NG recipes (forest bow, sword of reflection and short spear). I was "forced" to start again, and have no complains of that cause i'm still cautious about p2w item on l2store.

And i remember spend the entire week (if not more) farming for mats to craft 1 piece of my BW robe, with my clan. We did the same thing for every one of us, since top D. 

Again, my problem is a very likelly "no mats from drops/spoil unless you are a vip 4".

 

3 hours ago, Rck said:

Hey, I know this is off topic, but do you mind sharing this run? I’m still in early lvls. 

In the dwarf village, in the consil of elder you can get 3 quests (names maybe wrong, but ou get all there): convert business to kill bats and get 100 itens (each bat can give you 1~4 itens), dreaming of skies to kill magical weavers and get 50 itens (each one can give 1~2 itens) and brigade sweep to kill goblins.

the bats and weavers quests will give you 2.4k adena + 1 ring each (2.4x2 =4.8). Each ring can be sold on the npc for a little more than 1k, giving you 2k (4.8+2=6.8). The goblin quest will give you a random amount, but since you will kill a lot of goblin brigade lieutenents (there is a lot there an they are agressives) you will get a item called "suspicius contract", this item will give 500 adenas if you talk to the silver guild npc before talk to the golden-something npc (the one who will give the goblin quest)

So with all this you will get 7.3k+random. It will take more time than the spider quests, but has a lot less poeple doing this (until now).

 

2 hours ago, beleaua said:

now reading this, i'm wondering why people compare this to 2004? replace the year with late 2005, when we had c4, and the situation is totally different. everything was a lot more easier for many years, a few times more easier than the current eu (skelth) server. from 2004 to 2005 is just a year, from 2005 to 2011 (god patch)  it's a lot more years.

even the beginning is proved (with the prima guide) to have more adena drops than now.

now i'm not against people liking harder content, some are masochists like that. but i'm against people comparing, telling it was harder back then when it was not. it's just that people now have accumulated all that experience from the past and put it to good use now, while in the past  we were just admiring the environment for days doing nothing in the game. in the past it was all a journey, an adventure, nobody knew what to do. today we went straight to being efficient and skipped all that.

I compare the atual with 2004 cause was when i started to play and didnt know how to play, nor my friends did, and i saw that people dont know how to play the game now. our fisrt party was 2 elf tankers, me and one of my best friends, and 2 dwarfs (1 was a girl who thought they were cute, and the other was her boyfriend who was forced to play a dwarf to make company to her), them we got a humam warrior (from my work place) and a elf mystic that wanted to use heavy armor to play... 

Yeah... we didnt know shit... 

Than about 1 month after we started, we saw a bingandine helm for 500k, that made me "study" L2 to learn how to make money, change my main to a bishop to heal, and our elf became our main buff. We started to look for data bases to know what and where to farm, and so on... Our fun came from get our things first, and i mean to be able to do our equips just by farming. We werent on the Top of the server in the begining, and when we got to grade C, we had about 3 moths of game, but we all had our equip done by ourselfs.

I got off track, sry. 

The point i was trying to make is: we had to learn to play by the game rules, we had to adapt to the server, not the other wise. the only prob that i have is that the server is, very likelly, been nerfed to were no one with out vip or NCcoins will be able to do what we did/i'm doing: take your time to progress, slowlly yes, but progress nother the less.

And again, i'm in favor of less adena and a good grind with transparence. What i really want is that we are not lied like in the first week, if they told us "this is a really hardcore server, with almost no adena, spoil or drops" none who jumped aboard would have the right to complain.

Did i mention that i love Xcom and dark souls? just saying

3 hours ago, IceAge said:

@Kaizant you still didn't say your level.

We all know that in lower level's the adena and spoil is .. decent at max. The problem starts above 30+ , especially after 40.

Getting 28 on my spoiler, almost 30 on my buffer and my dps (an archer). They not really a concern to craft equipment for now, thats why i said that i'm rolling 3 chars, and i wopuld gladlly play only on my main acc if more people have the same mentality as me. yesterday a guys asked me party an i told him that i was there for spoil, not exp. He told me "no problem" and quit 3 mobs after saying "low exp... gg noob".

I thought i told that i'm low lvl, and thats why i can see the "truth" (in quotes cause i still need to get there to verify, i usually dont go with the flow, i rather be cautious and make my own testing) when people says that its impossible to farm at lvl 40+.

Again (yes, i will point my thoughts all the time), i'm not against grind, i'm against force the players not be able to progress unless they spend money like a mobile game. If they came out and say "the rate is X an we will adjust to lower cause people are progressing too fast, and that is not the hardcore experience qe want, we want that people have to work hard, kill themselfs for drops, think out the box, etc..." with no l2store bullshit, i'm all in.

l2store selling what they are nerfing is the problem.

[wildernessbox]

Honestly, at this point it might be better to just increase everything to the 1x rates and be done with it, that way no one can really say the grass is greener on x server anymore. It will get this whole issue out of the way so they can focus on something else entirely, like further progression in the upcoming months or other issues that arise, or small class balances,, tiny qol changes, etc.

[Devoid]

57 minutes ago, wildernessbox said:

Honestly, at this point it might be better to just increase everything to the 1x rates and be done with it, that way no one can really say the grass is greener on x server anymore.

That will simply make all servers permanently full with 5k users in queue thanks to bots.

[Kaizant]

1 hour ago, wildernessbox said:

Honestly, at this point it might be better to just increase everything to the 1x rates and be done with it, that way no one can really say the grass is greener on x server anymore. It will get this whole issue out of the way so they can focus on something else entirely, like further progression in the upcoming months or other issues that arise, or small class balances,, tiny qol changes, etc.

Yeah, 1x is already good to the game, or at least reveal the real and unic rate for all lvl ranges.

 

8 minutes ago, Devoid said:

That will simply make all servers permanently full with 5k users in queue thanks to bots.

That would be a good thing to work on: eliminate the bots, but we all know that RMT, unfortunatelly, will always be here. To us it's a game, for them it's a gold mine!

Someone on Dofus forum posted a link to a documentary showing how the RMT "industry" works, and thas was enlighting... they pay good to know hackers from deep web to bypass anti-cheats like xincode and make milions per month. At the recording of the documentary (i think it was in 2008 or so) was something like pay 50k to a hacker, bypass for about 2 months, earn 2~3m per month, get blocked, repeat the process. Most of us think of them as some "shady" thing going on basemets, but what was shown there was comercial builds rented, with a real calculated infraestructure to maximise profit.

 

Off to farm... need 330 iron ores for my trident.

[Devoid]

11 minutes ago, Kaizant said:

Someone on Dofus forum posted a link to a documentary showing how the RMT "industry" works, and thas was enlighting... they pay good to know hackers from deep web to bypass anti-cheats like xincode and make milions per month. At the recording of the documentary (i think it was in 2008 or so) was something like pay 50k to a hacker, bypass for about 2 months, earn 2~3m per month, get blocked, repeat the process. Most of us think of them as some "shady" thing going on basemets, but what was shown there was comercial builds rented, with a real calculated infraestructure to maximise profit.

Adena sellers, like any other business, calculate on what they can achieve and what is the max price they can sell at to still cash in steady profits. Some are simple resellers, buying cheap from certain affiliated clans or even solo players.

However, you don't need hackers nor the so-called "deep web" access to bypass xigncode, nor BE, nor Frost, as those are all running locally (which means on a 'hostile environment') and you can simply investigate what they are doing and workaround their expectations (or just emulate their responses).

[Medeoan]

13 hours ago, beleaua said:

now reading this, i'm wondering why people compare this to 2004? replace the year with late 2005, when we had c4, and the situation is totally different. everything was a lot more easier for many years, a few times more easier than the current eu (skelth) server. from 2004 to 2005 is just a year, from 2005 to 2011 (god patch)  it's a lot more years.

even the beginning is proved (with the prima guide) to have more adena drops than now.

now i'm not against people liking harder content, some are masochists like that. but i'm against people comparing, telling it was harder back then when it was not. it's just that people now have accumulated all that experience from the past and put it to good use now, while in the past  we were just admiring the environment for days doing nothing in the game. in the past it was all a journey, an adventure, nobody knew what to do. today we went straight to being efficient and skipped all that.

https://forums.lineage2.com/topic/6705-stop-quoting-the-prima-guide/

 

Please, please, PLEASE stop quoting the damn Prima Guide.

[Darlik]

I did some calculations this morning.

 

To buy a D mid weapon we need 1.200.000 (weapon shopping)

To create a D mid weapon we need 750.000

Sell mats that you need to creare the weapon gives you 500.000

You gain 270 mats with spoil in 8 hours.

You gain 450 harder mats in 36 hours.

(Solo farming)

[Medeoan]

1 hour ago, Kaizant said:

That would be a good thing to work on: eliminate the bots, but we all know that RMT, unfortunatelly, will always be here. To us it's a game, for them it's a gold mine!

Like any business, if you want to truly kill it, you have to get the Wallet Warrior and Land-whales to stop buying adena. One way to do that is to track the flow of adena over a period of time. Eventually it becomes clear who has purchased goods from an RMT service. You ban the accounts that sourced the adena and you strip the buyer of all assets until the value of deleted adena and gear is roughly = to what they purchased.

 

Now the Wallet Warrior is naked and penniless in game. Either they will RMT again, quit, or wise and learn. If they do option 1, you repeat the punishment. You keep doing this until the Wallet Warriors learn NOT to engage in RMT. Once they stop patronizing the RMT businesses, the RMT shops will pack up and move on.

[beleaua]

55 minutes ago, Medeoan said:

https://forums.lineage2.com/topic/6705-stop-quoting-the-prima-guide/

 

Please, please, PLEASE stop quoting the damn Prima Guide.

because it's some proof of older times while you have zero proof of being otherwise than stated there? only that 'i have played  i remember...'. we all played but memories are a tricky thing.

[Kaizant]

52 minutes ago, beleaua said:

because it's some proof of older times while you have zero proof of being otherwise than stated there? only that 'i have played  i remember...'. we all played but memories are a tricky thing.

You have a point there.

TBH I didnt remember that guide at all.