Jump to content
Forums

Something needs to be done about this (Flagging/PvP/Griefing)


Recommended Posts

23 hours ago, Dannyboy said:

There is no one fix for this PvP system.  But I feel a great start would be if you are RED and someone tries to KILL the RED player, THEY go purple.  This way you could PK BR asshats that have zero respect for other gamers.  And your party could defend you if they come back to try to kill the red.

 

Hitting REDS makes you go PURPLE,  Also a red can defend himself and not take more Karma.

 

D, 

not purple but yes a certain way/color flag a red can defend himself without gaining more karma and be forced to go permared or die. whats the point of killing someone if it forces u to die and lose the same amount of exp and eventually even armor

Edited by Sediyon
Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Sediyon said:

not purple but yes a certain way/color flag a red can defend himself without gaining more karma and be forced to go permared or die. whats the point of killing someone if it forces u to die and lose the same amount of exp and eventually even armor

That's the price you pay for killing someone that cannot or did not defend themselves. You're basically asking for a free pass to kill anyone you like. That's not how the game ever worked and it'd be a terrible idea for the health of the servers.

Link to post
Share on other sites
On 10/28/2018 at 12:36 PM, Evoria said:

This is a PvP game.  My question is: How are we supposed to defend against this type of griefing? On the official servers this wouldn't have been a problem because players would flag if their AoE skills hit another flagged player.  Why was this feature taken out?  It doesn't prevent griefing at all.  All it does is switch the dynamic of who can grief.  

This mechanic still exists, it only exists with skills that do not require a target (as most higher level AOE's don't).  You are 100% incorrect in your assumption there.  But I understand your frustration.

It's just amplified at 40- because everything requires target, therefore you cannot force someone to flag.  The "quality of life" change to next target to allow players to only target monsters is also affecting this dynamic as well.  (Terrible change)

Due to the PK system being stupidly harsh penalties and free teleports, there's little point to PK and not a whole lot you can do other than get them to fight, win or lose.

There are counter-griefing tactics that work well too, what works to grief you works to grief them too.  I am particularly good at this part of the game so I don't generally have problems with griefers, but sometimes it's more difficult than others due to the current way the PK system works.

Just yesterday we forced 3 parties of br's out of lizards by forcing them to pvp or die to mobs, 1 of those parties stuck around to try to grief us, but our dps beat theirs so they dispersed after about 20 minutes.  One of the nukers stuck around to grief more and eventually he died to our party griefing him.  That's the game, honestly.  We knew all along we would win, because we knew we would outlast them no matter what.  Sure it slowed us down, but not as much as 4 parties trying to exp in 1 spot.

Essentially, the more patient person wins unless you are just completely over dps'd, unless you get creative which most players are not capable of doing or willing to do.  If your party is much weaker, then well yeah you should lose the spot.

Edited by FatHips
Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, Tool_of_Society said:

That's the price you pay for killing someone that cannot or did not defend themselves. You're basically asking for a free pass to kill anyone you like. That's not how the game ever worked and it'd be a terrible idea for the health of the servers.

The game use to punish you for going red, but not to the extent it is now. Right now the pendulum has swung to far in the other direction, and has turned the game so anti-PK that anyone can abuse and grief parties and no one can really bother doing anything about it. 

 

Its not asking to be allowed to go kill anyone you want, or to kill anyone you want to take their hunting spot.  The problem now is anyone can come to your area where you are partying, and after you have aggro, they can freely attack your mobs, run in and spoil them, or in the case of AOE parties, can stand beside your party, pull out their pole, and attack, steal your XP and Adena and other drops.  They will never flag on you.  And if you kill them, you will be the one punished by the game, because they can just return and attack you, and if you choose to defend yourself, you will just dig yourself deeper and deeper into perma red.  

 

Before, If you kept your PK count below 5, you use to be able to wash the karma in maybe 20-30 mob kills, and by the time the person returned you would be white, and they couldn't attack you freely.  The way it is now, you need approx 700 mobs to wash the Karma from your first PK.  Which gives them alot of time to come back and freely attack you without being able to defend yourself.  Which in the end means you just let anyone freely do whatever they want.

Link to post
Share on other sites
6 hours ago, Vivisector said:

The game use to punish you for going red, but not to the extent it is now. Right now the pendulum has swung to far in the other direction, and has turned the game so anti-PK that anyone can abuse and grief parties and no one can really bother doing anything about it. 

 

Its not asking to be allowed to go kill anyone you want, or to kill anyone you want to take their hunting spot.  The problem now is anyone can come to your area where you are partying, and after you have aggro, they can freely attack your mobs, run in and spoil them, or in the case of AOE parties, can stand beside your party, pull out their pole, and attack, steal your XP and Adena and other drops.  They will never flag on you.  And if you kill them, you will be the one punished by the game, because they can just return and attack you, and if you choose to defend yourself, you will just dig yourself deeper and deeper into perma red.  

 

Before, If you kept your PK count below 5, you use to be able to wash the karma in maybe 20-30 mob kills, and by the time the person returned you would be white, and they couldn't attack you freely.  The way it is now, you need approx 700 mobs to wash the Karma from your first PK.  Which gives them alot of time to come back and freely attack you without being able to defend yourself.  Which in the end means you just let anyone freely do whatever they want.

It's funny you say that because Russian classic servers are having issues with CPs using perma reds to extort adena and real life money out of people. If you don't pay up then they'll PK every time you try to level there.

You have choices for dealing with KSers that involve PVP and PVE. Learn how aggro works or just learn to do better dps. Since you're working with a group the KSers shouldn't be able to keep up with change ups and such. Bring a huge group of mobs while keeping your aggro light that way the KSer will die quickly when they run up to attack. ETC ETc. If you don't have a spoiler why do you care? If you do then your spoiler should be more on the ball.

Want to wash that red quickly? give your items to a friend/box and then have that friend/box kill you a couple times. Blammo red gone.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Nothing "needs to be done".

You need to figure it out.

Everyone is begging the GM to change the game mechanics. L2 is largely player-run, from party/clan politics, ro the economy, this game belongs to the players.

Stop begging for a babysitter and stand up for yourself, or live the consequences of being a sheep.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Overall the pk quest and karma grind off could use some tweaks. Either to the rate you can grind things off or have the quest cost scale with levels/other factors. As it is now the pk system is mostly obsolete or anti-fun, instead, everyone is doing this weird grief ks thing where you frustratedly mash your keyboard and hope to dps faster than the other person or group while wishing you could pk them, but won't since you basically lose the spot at that point(as they rarely ever flag up), or you try to stun shot them/train mobs on them. All of the above are just ways of griefing and can't really be considered "pvp" since you aren't actually fighting them for the spot per say.

They don't have to rework the whole system, just tweak certain aspects so going red is actually a viable option, rather than a waste of time and money.

Link to post
Share on other sites
21 hours ago, FatHips said:

This mechanic still exists, it only exists with skills that do not require a target (as most higher level AOE's don't).  You are 100% incorrect in your assumption there.  But I understand your frustration.

It's just amplified at 40- because everything requires target, therefore you cannot force someone to flag.  The "quality of life" change to next target to allow players to only target monsters is also affecting this dynamic as well.  (Terrible change)

Due to the PK system being stupidly harsh penalties and free teleports, there's little point to PK and not a whole lot you can do other than get them to fight, win or lose.

There are counter-griefing tactics that work well too, what works to grief you works to grief them too.  I am particularly good at this part of the game so I don't generally have problems with griefers, but sometimes it's more difficult than others due to the current way the PK system works.

Just yesterday we forced 3 parties of br's out of lizards by forcing them to pvp or die to mobs, 1 of those parties stuck around to try to grief us, but our dps beat theirs so they dispersed after about 20 minutes.  One of the nukers stuck around to grief more and eventually he died to our party griefing him.  That's the game, honestly.  We knew all along we would win, because we knew we would outlast them no matter what.  Sure it slowed us down, but not as much as 4 parties trying to exp in 1 spot.

Essentially, the more patient person wins unless you are just completely over dps'd, unless you get creative which most players are not capable of doing or willing to do.  If your party is much weaker, then well yeah you should lose the spot.

Well that's good to know. So I guess my problem goes away after 40. Now I'm curious about the ok system though. How bad is the sin eater quest now? 

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
×
×
  • Create New...