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PSA on Automated Macros and PvP

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Afum    40
Just now, Whatif said:

Its related to flagging unflagging system. If your macro take flaged target right before it unflags and enemy dies white  because your macro targeted him alrdy , it will count as PK .

Y i know that , but damn its almost immpossible :P its like miliseconds :D

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balanceLife    2
2 hours ago, Afum said:

Y i know that , but damn its almost immpossible :P its like miliseconds :D

Hahaha, its rly easy :D

Example(maybe Next Target macro) :

/target Cantera video :

 

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Pleistoros    105

Macro is safe to use if you are not greedy....Mixa is right.

Usually ppl use:

/nexttarget

/atack

Instead of using:

/target mob name

/atack

Wynns should not put sumons on defence and Its true, using mob name is not so eficient...but still, you exp/do quest while watching a good movie.

I dont understand...after all this time you still have that problem...and Conquero need to put a special disclaimer...Damn, I thought you guys are smarter.

Edited by Pleistoros

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Afum    40
7 hours ago, Pleistoros said:

 

/target mob name

/atack

 

That what i meant that macro is safe if u know how to proper use it

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BurnCycle    19
On 08/02/2018 at 4:17 AM, Draecke said:

thanks for the clarification, funny that it was needed but hey while we're at it stating the obvious etc. can you provide us an official stance from NCWest on Adrenaline usage now that it's usage is increasing with no visible counter actions done by NC to battle it ?

was taking out zRanger & l2tower just something done to shuffle the whole script abuse under the carpet and it is cost to much to keep the big data analytics running on the back end to auto ban 3rd party soft users ?

just curious as if nothing get's done and this is the beginning of the 2nd golden age of scripting it could quite well end up being the final nail..

This!

@Neutron @Conguero

Looking on today's Dimentional siege, we going back to the script wars again? They are not even afraid to hide now!

PS: Funny how people die by priority now in the siegefield! lol

Edited by BurnCycle

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On ‎8‎. ‎02‎. ‎2018 at 1:55 AM, Conguero said:

We’ve recently seen confusion in the community regarding what is considered fair play in PvP, and how a player using the Automated Macros system while AFK can potentially avoid incurring PKs or losing valuable items. For anyone who has been in this scenario and unclear about NCSOFT policies, here’s where we stand.

Using Hunting Macros While AFK (Don’t!)

First and foremost, while the Automated Macros system in Lineage 2 was designed to be robust enough that players can streamline certain elements of gameplay, it’s not built to be a bot tool. In fact, target macros are intentionally kept very simple to prevent any complex automated gameplay. Regardless of how creative and comprehensive your macros are, it’s expected that you’re using them while actively playing or observing your character at all times. You’re responsible for all of the actions of your character and there is no separate policy to protect you from any potential consequences you may face while AFK.

Putting the Penalty in the PK

Lineage 2 is considered an open PvP game in which PKs are intended to deter players from engaging in combat with each other without accepting the associated risks. Ultimately PKs can result in the loss of equipped items regardless of their value or usefulness—this includes items that ordinarily can’t be dropped. There’s a fair amount of PvP persistence required while playing the game normally to reach this point. If you’re using macros while AFK, however, you should know that your character is not immune from PKs either. As target macros don’t distinguish between friend and foe, your AFK farming routine can potentially be disrupted to pull your character into a PvP state and incur PKs.

Be warned! If you lose an exceptionally rare and powerful piece of equipment to another player while you’re AFK, Customer Support will be unable to restore it for you. Ultimately the situation of losing items to PK is easily avoided, and hopefully this info helps you stay safe out there!

Sincerely,

The Lineage II Team

I think ppl asked also one another thing.

To implement target next function which distinguish between flagged and non flagged target.

Basically to have two target next functions.

I dont care about afk macros and pk you are talking about.

I talk about preventing unwanted flagging when hunting which is abused a lot by flagged pkers ( or low hp flagged pet)  mixed with  mobs waiting you to use target next or aoe.

That is not afk macroing but just hunting and using target  next function  and when you realise that next target is not a mob but flagged pker is too late - you are already flagged.

*this is circumventing game mechanic as hunter do not keep pressed CTRL key to attack the mob.

Are you suggesting that people play only solo instances to prevent being hunted by pkers?

About afk macros - as investments in gear need a lot of money question is what you intend to do to keep our investments safe?

 

Edited by SleepingPower

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N4zgul    16
8 hours ago, BurnCycle said:

This!

@Neutron @Conguero

Looking on today's Dimentional siege, we going back to the script wars again? They are not even afraid to hide now!

PS: Funny how people die by priority now in the siegefield! lol

a lot of ppl from naia can confirm some dh members using scripts for interrupt skills and re-targeting in milliseconds in pvp. all time, not only a mystake/or a bug. they want to win, no matter the price, even they already have endgame gear. yes, can be the final nail in the coffin. Neutron, Conguero, what u have to answer about this? u keep this game only for top donnors and the rest can be meatshield? 

Edited by N4zgul

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Argus    170

Hello guys, 

communication between NCsoft West and us, the players is not productive at all! 

Support should be better for sure, Forum should be reviewed by NCsoft moderators 24/7! Look what is going on, scammers scam people for 60b+, scripters for sure as always all over the server, problems problems, that's all we see last 2 months.

IMO it is not such a HUGE effort for NCwest to take care of most of the problems, get the people playing actively and increase the player base. There are ways to invite fresh new players, which will be great for both Naia and Freya.

Some of the items sold in L2 Store are so outdated or so full of junk, they should all be revised..etc etc .. 

So much can be done ... 

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jaGerX    13
On 2/7/2018 at 11:17 PM, Draecke said:

thanks for the clarification, funny that it was needed but hey while we're at it stating the obvious etc. can you provide us an official stance from NCWest on Adrenaline usage now that it's usage is increasing with no visible counter actions done by NC to battle it ?

was taking out zRanger & l2tower just something done to shuffle the whole script abuse under the carpet and it is cost to much to keep the big data analytics running on the back end to auto ban 3rd party soft users ?

just curious as if nothing get's done and this is the beginning of the 2nd golden age of scripting it could quite well end up being the final nail..

 

On 2/7/2018 at 11:39 PM, buffgirl said:

Can you guys actually look into pvp radar and adrenaline usage on players?

 

Thanks.

 

On 2/8/2018 at 5:11 AM, Ferine said:

+1 for wanting an official stance on all the players using Adrenaline and other 3rd party programs for PvP and Dragons etc. Have you changed your stance on it being against the rules? It seems perfectly fine for people to do it right now. There's already PvE bot trains popping up around the map in places like AF etc.

 

If scripting isn't getting looked into then people might as well stop being competitive or PvPing. If people stop bothering competing then there's not much point buying your overpriced NCStore junk, I guess at least the bot program makers make some money out of it though. 

 

 

 

On 2/8/2018 at 8:01 AM, Ferine said:

Fixing PvP software won't fix the gear issue, although it will help a bit, mostly help for clan activities such as dragon raid entry etc. You can't underestimate the effect of all of the pay 2 win garbage in the game now. Sadly even I admit that removing the pay 2 win gear would have much more of an effect on the game than fixing pvp automation at the moment.

 

On 2/10/2018 at 8:20 PM, Whatif said:

Confirmed , Adrenaline is functioning and pvp is automated at the moment. CoC , olympiad , Sieges mainly.  Conquero  , you should address this problem asap.

 

13 hours ago, BurnCycle said:

This!

@Neutron @Conguero

Looking on today's Dimentional siege, we going back to the script wars again? They are not even afraid to hide now!

PS: Funny how people die by priority now in the siegefield! lol

 

5 hours ago, N4zgul said:

a lot of ppl from naia can confirm some dh members using scripts for interrupt skills and re-targeting in milliseconds in pvp. all time, not only a mystake/or a bug. they want to win, no matter the price, even they already have endgame gear. yes, can be the final nail in the coffin. Neutron, Conguero, what u have to answer about this? u keep this game only for top donnors and the rest can be meatshield? 

 

49 minutes ago, Draecke said:

how much you think NCWest cares ? they really should but their track record on this is pretty bad

1d4GGtG.png

Bad players be bad players....

Thanks for easiest dim siege of our lives....

Nova needs to just hang it up before it gets anymore embarassing..

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Whatif    16
1 minute ago, jaGerX said:

 

Bad players be bad players....

Thanks for easiest dim siege of our lives....

Nova needs to just hang it up before it gets anymore embarassing..

I have nothing to do with Nova. But i have very nice eye to distinguish automated game play versus manual click. 14 years experience and +20 passives  enables to do so. Do not even try to cover script abusers. It is in game now. If you know what is probability , you should know that  only 1 way to achieve 100% interuption of rebirth skills etc , and this this is code only.

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OmenOfSteel    143

I have no idea about MS/Nova/Max and not interested on what you guys do or don't.

But we caught our lovely DragonHunters red handed 2 months ago, and I can assure you it's gotten MUCH worse since than.

I hope NCWest care and acts, and only with permabans this time.

Evidence:

 

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Chrysty    23

That's simple, as Yideo posted few days ago, the mathematics algorithm explainations, if anyone was enought interested about it can read that this "new system of bot detection" is based on 7 days log analyses. If you use your soft for 1 day only, every 1 weeks / 2 weeks ... Then you are not considered as bot ...

And that's probably why DH / MS (dunno about MS since i wasn't on las dim siege) and others start back using them for sieges .. That's really sad ..

Edited by Chrysty

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jaGerX    13
3 hours ago, Whatif said:

I have nothing to do with Nova. But i have very nice eye to distinguish automated game play versus manual click. 14 years experience and +20 passives  enables to do so. Do not even try to cover script abusers. It is in game now. If you know what is probability , you should know that  only 1 way to achieve 100% interuption of rebirth skills etc , and this this is code only.

bad players be bad

 

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Whatif    16
2 hours ago, Chrysty said:

That's simple, as Yideo posted few days ago, the mathematics algorithm explainations, if anyone was enought interested about it can read that this "new system of bot detection" is based on 7 days log analyses. If you use your soft for 1 day only, every 1 weeks / 2 weeks ... Then you are not considered as bot ...

And that's probably why DH / MS (dunno about MS since i wasn't on las dim siege) and others start back using them for sieges .. That's really sad ..

they should just do weekend log analysis . That would be enough )

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Hydrogen    14

There are a lot of ppl that lost their items due to force pk though. Lot of tickets sent to your team. Is there any chance to restore those items? Seems like this macro system will get improved in the near future (pve - pvp function). By this, at the moment it can be considered as "not working properly" situation. 

 

Bottom line, lot of ppl forced to lose items and that can happen in a minute or so. No need to be afk whole night.

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Sniffo    7
On 2/12/2018 at 12:13 PM, Chrysty said:

That's simple, as Yideo posted few days ago, the mathematics algorithm explainations, if anyone was enought interested about it can read that this "new system of bot detection" is based on 7 days log analyses. If you use your soft for 1 day only, every 1 weeks / 2 weeks ... Then you are not considered as bot ...

And that's probably why DH / MS (dunno about MS since i wasn't on las dim siege) and others start back using them for sieges .. That's really sad ..

If MS is only using bots 1 day per week, why does Nova lose at sieges, dragons, and any other random PvP? Wouldn't half of MS be banned by now?

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On ‎12‎. ‎02‎. ‎2018 at 3:24 PM, OmenOfSteel said:

I have no idea about MS/Nova/Max and not interested on what you guys do or don't.

But we caught our lovely DragonHunters red handed 2 months ago, and I can assure you it's gotten MUCH worse since than.

I hope NCWest care and acts, and only with permabans this time.

Evidence:

 

Its good that players find time to discover bots and I'm thankful but  punishment should be left for NCSOFT and their GMs.

No one of regular players should act in a way to not allow other players to enjoy the game.

In video I see that flagged dude kill several times non flagged player without getting red.

Whatever explanation is this should not be possible by game pvp rules.

Its a flaw, its a game design bug.

Bad is that NCSOFT not only condone this behavior but encourage it.

Do not forget that is not any more subscription game where an molested player loose time and max 20$ of subscription.

NCSOFT forced new playing model not by players choice (players got converted remaining months of subscription to NCoins).

So now we have pay to win model where players instead of 20$ monthly dump several hundreds usd into NCoins each month and use  them in L2store.

Don't know how players do but there are certain players who hunt in constant perma flagged mode.

For me that and similar situations are actions of robbery.

No need to go in extreme making other players red forcing pvp and making them loose equipment.

No need  that player loose part of gear to be robbed.

Its enough to find way to kill player just once and is already robbery as that player did spend in L2store, paid for vitality potions, for exp scrolls, exp rune ect.

Game is full bugged and badly designed if it allow unwanted flagging and unwanted pvp what can result in robbery.

And is nonsense that devs by condoning and encouraging it recommend not to use their own L2storte as is actually very sick  and stupid idea because you can loose all you ever put in game.

Edited by SleepingPower

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Yidao    149
9 hours ago, Sniffo said:

If MS is only using bots 1 day per week, why does Nova lose at sieges, dragons, and any other random PvP? Wouldn't half of MS be banned by now?

That's because Neutron has disabled the anti-bot system so that the Adrenaline summoners can farm the adena that is then via the L2Store converted into the dollars needed in San Mateo. As Chrysty said, the system simply checks the server logs for repetitive behavior patterns. There is no interface where you can set Adrenaline = good bot, CorgiNet = bad bot:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/316906710_You_are_a_Game_Bot_Uncovering_Game_Bots_in_MMORPGs_via_Self-similarity_in_the_Wild

You either have no bots or all bots. So "I don't care about the RMT bots in low-level hunting grounds, I just want fair PvP" is not a valid statement. Those low-level summoners are, because of their high number, a precise statistical indicator for bot usage in PvP.

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Draecke    439
6 hours ago, Yidao said:

That's because Neutron has disabled the anti-bot system so that the Adrenaline summoners can farm the adena that is then via the L2Store converted into the dollars needed in San Mateo. As Chrysty said, the system simply checks the server logs for repetitive behavior patterns. There is no interface where you can set Adrenaline = good bot, CorgiNet = bad bot:
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/316906710_You_are_a_Game_Bot_Uncovering_Game_Bots_in_MMORPGs_via_Self-similarity_in_the_Wild

You either have no bots or all bots. So "I don't care about the RMT bots in low-level hunting grounds, I just want fair PvP" is not a valid statement. Those low-level summoners are, because of their high number, a precise statistical indicator for bot usage in PvP.

don't bother.. they know it's disabled, that's why they're being so arrogant about it.. it's like back in the days when dumb players would post pictures of their chars on the old official forum with l2tower stuff visible on it.. kinda pathetic but hey the win at all cost mentality runs strong in some people..

but wait for it soon someone will say one of the following

  1. you guys were among the worst cheaters back in the day of zR - yeah well keep livin in the past, most sane ppl were relieved when the script arms race was ended and moved on to enjoy the script free new reality which btw was quite fun even if it only lasted as shortly as it did..
  2. we just click faster/better tactics then you guys do for dragons - yeah sure when at each dragon spawn npc there are like 4 CC's (incl. neutral PVE clans) all clicking but only 1 CC always manages to enter with 100% success rate for over 2 Months we still gotta believe those fairy tales, that stuff ain't possible statistically speaking so good luck with that argument lol - everyone on Chronos knows better

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BurnCycle    19
4 hours ago, Draecke said:

don't bother.. they know it's disabled, that's why they're being so arrogant about it.. it's like back in the days when dumb players would post pictures of their chars on the old official forum with l2tower stuff visible on it.. kinda pathetic but hey the win at all cost mentality runs strong in some people..

but wait for it soon someone will say one of the following

  1. you guys were among the worst cheaters back in the day of zR - yeah well keep livin in the past, most sane ppl were relieved when the script arms race was ended and moved on to enjoy the script free new reality which btw was quite fun even if it only lasted as shortly as it did..
  2. we just click faster/better tactics then you guys do for dragons - yeah sure when at each dragon spawn npc there are like 4 CC's (incl. neutral PVE clans) all clicking but only 1 CC always manages to enter with 100% success rate for over 2 Months we still gotta believe those fairy tales, that stuff ain't possible statistically speaking so good luck with that argument lol - everyone on Chronos knows better

Don't complain Draecke, your class is now the last class standing on sieges so you outlive all your party thanks to this scripts!

The ridiculous things get!

PS: The worst thing in all this is the silence from Neutron/Conguero. They don't even try to find excuses anymore...

Edited by BurnCycle

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Maark    3

placing the fact that AFK Macro is frowned upon, aside.

@Conguero @Hime

what is being done with the blatant fact that game mechanics are being exploited in order to influence an outcome, in this case, an item from a player? wherein some cases a financial loss incurred. (items that can not otherwise be obtained through natural means. L2Store, L2Galary)

furthermore, where is the section of the User agreement stating I can or can not exploit or attempt to manipulate the outcome of the game through the exploitation or abuse of game mechanics?

as a responsible game promoter that NCsoft is. I feel a notification in both L2store, L2Galary, and MasterAccounts. stating or disclaming a financial loss can or may occur due to game mechanics and the lack thereof. is required and in many cases mandated.

 

Have a good day; look forward to reading what you have to say.

 

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On 2/10/2018 at 11:03 PM, balanceLife said:

Hahaha, its rly easy :D

Example(maybe Next Target macro) :

/target Cantera video :

 

So easy that people always post the same two videos to "prove" how easy it is to do..

Seriously I've seen those same two videos pop up in every thread where the topic is brought up.

The flagging system has worked this way since closed beta. People tried to exploit it back then and failed at least 99% of the time. All it takes is one success though and they crowed about it to the moon and back.

 

Edited by Tool_of_Society

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AiZeN    50
On 2/15/2018 at 3:37 AM, BurnCycle said:

Don't complain Draecke, your class is now the last class standing on sieges so you outlive all your party thanks to this scripts!

The ridiculous things get!

PS: The worst thing in all this is the silence from Neutron/Conguero. They don't even try to find excuses anymore...

Oh god you're still at it let me spell it out for you ok? since I don't think your puny brain can process how you're always the last one standing on sieges first off Tanks has better defense stats now with the help of focus shield/raise shield that you can spam permanently with proper setups not to mention most tanks nowadays plays with knight harmony lvl 2 which makes them even more tankier going for at least 60k pdef/40k mdef no DD will be dumb enough to target that when they can target iss/dds or even healers who has way lower stats but keep insisting that you're the last man standing cause people are scripting not because unlike your dumb dds in Max the other clans doesn't target enemy tanks lmao god I told you stop writing you're just freaking humiliating yourself with your stupid remarks..........

On 2/13/2018 at 1:13 AM, Chrysty said:

That's simple, as Yideo posted few days ago, the mathematics algorithm explainations, if anyone was enought interested about it can read that this "new system of bot detection" is based on 7 days log analyses. If you use your soft for 1 day only, every 1 weeks / 2 weeks ... Then you are not considered as bot ...

And that's probably why DH / MS (dunno about MS since i wasn't on las dim siege) and others start back using them for sieges .. That's really sad ..

MS cheating lmao is that really the best you can come up? God you dogs are so freaking dumb... There might be people using scripts for PvE farming like those wynns but who in their right mind will risk cheating and getting banned. I'm not a huge fan of DH but I don't think they're dumb to use a script on f2pr while he has a dragon weapon on him or anyone from DH use any script at all since from what I saw they improved a lot of their gears since I left Naia. Though I find it cute that you're not there in last dime siege and you're spreading bs that people are cheating that's why your clan lost their castle dog your clan leader is just plain dumb this past 3 months not only your clan lost aden not only once but twice how does even anyone lose a castle with all the advantages a defender has and how easy it is to interrupt the caster nowadays >_> 

On 2/14/2018 at 10:52 PM, Draecke said:

don't bother.. they know it's disabled, that's why they're being so arrogant about it.. it's like back in the days when dumb players would post pictures of their chars on the old official forum with l2tower stuff visible on it.. kinda pathetic but hey the win at all cost mentality runs strong in some people..

but wait for it soon someone will say one of the following

  1. you guys were among the worst cheaters back in the day of zR - yeah well keep livin in the past, most sane ppl were relieved when the script arms race was ended and moved on to enjoy the script free new reality which btw was quite fun even if it only lasted as shortly as it did..
  2. we just click faster/better tactics then you guys do for dragons - yeah sure when at each dragon spawn npc there are like 4 CC's (incl. neutral PVE clans) all clicking but only 1 CC always manages to enter with 100% success rate for over 2 Months we still gotta believe those fairy tales, that stuff ain't possible statistically speaking so good luck with that argument lol - everyone on Chronos knows better

Oh boy here we go again if we're cheating hard in PvP how it is that our "scripts" lost last dime siege on 1 push to rune when truffle is not around and you guys have peppinio and evey with 2 dragon weapons cause dude you guys are bunch of idiots the reason ya'll winning back then and controlling chronos is because not only you hold the biggest zerg in chronos but you've got 2 dragon weapons to protect you not to mention you've got a handful of pet clans bowing at your feet but what does MS had back then? they had 2 PvP pts + some more pts that are not geared with that said how do you expect a couple of pts to fight a clan like Renovatio with 2 dragon weapons with twice the number and expect them to beat you? And now what does MS have MS have a solid organization the same numbers as Renovatio with the same amount of dragon weapons. Keep on making excuses of your incompetence as a player that we're cheating since that has brought you somewhere you guys are just so dumb and so arrogant to admit that the reason ya'll losing is because you're just not good enough and we're just that better than you. Renovatio is just a culmination of bandwagons and has beens how do you expect to be good at anything when your leadership doesn't allow its members to PvP outside of siege whilst MS allows its members to PvP whenever they want to and against whoever from Nova thus ofc the negative CRP. 

Edited by AiZeN

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