Why i doubt ill be sticking around

[Deathcoil]

Reliving the early days of l2 is refreshing, i forgot how hard it was to struggle at this bit by bit, day  by day. No shots or buffs and running around.l everywhere. I leveled a dagger and a healer supprt to 20 and find myself unable to afford anything. I dont recall it being this hard. At this rate ill be level 30 in ng gear getting 1/4 hp taken out every hit.

But its exactly that struggle that brings back bad memories. I recall how tough 40 was and the subsequent walls at 50, 55, 60 and so on. Endless hours of repetative grinding. I just cant put myself through that again. The death of this game is the outdated questing system that gives next to zero rewards. 

 

Bottom line is been there done that, i think its actually harder now to make adena so why torture myself? 

[Devoid]

Lineage II Classic is just another game. No need to force yourself to do it if you don't feel like it.

[ZygiA]

5 minutes ago, Deathcoil said:

Reliving the early days of l2 is refreshing, i forgot how hard it was to struggle at this bit by bit day  by day. No shots or buffs and running around.

But its exactly that struggle that brings back bad memories. I recall how tough 40 was and the subsequent walls at 50, 55, 60 and so on. Endless hours of repetative grinding. I just cant put myself through that again. The death of this game is the outdated questing system that gives next to zero rewards. 

 

Bottom line is been there done that, i think its actually harder now to make adena so why torture myself? 

No, actually, the real question is why did you even begin knowing that it will be an endless grind? Or were you somehow naive in thinking otherwise? Bye anyway. 

[Deathcoil]

11 minutes ago, ZygiA said:

No, actually, the real question is why did you even begin knowing that it will be an endless grind? Or were you somehow naive in thinking otherwise? Bye anyway. 

Notalgia mostly

[Oreoloveboss]

That seems silly, I had a long sword for 70k at like level 18, Falchion at level 21 and bought a D grade saber at 23 or 24. Similar for friends who are playing too.

Yes it's a grind but it's fun to play in groups and there are always people looking at popular spots like AC or Orc Barracks. I just play casually but like above it can be fun, it's also rewarding to see your adena rise, sell your old gear and upgrade, it really feels like progress where other games just give you 'bind on equip' gear that becomes worthless once you put it on and outgrow it, making it feel like the stuff you've done up to this point was worthless.

[Lawman]

1 hour ago, Deathcoil said:

Reliving the early days of l2 is refreshing, i forgot how hard it was to struggle at this bit by bit, day  by day. No shots or buffs and running around.l everywhere. I leveled a dagger and a healer supprt to 20 and find myself unable to afford anything. I dont recall it being this hard. At this rate ill be level 30 in ng gear getting 1/4 hp taken out every hit.

But its exactly that struggle that brings back bad memories. I recall how tough 40 was and the subsequent walls at 50, 55, 60 and so on. Endless hours of repetative grinding. I just cant put myself through that again. The death of this game is the outdated questing system that gives next to zero rewards. 

 

Bottom line is been there done that, i think its actually harder now to make adena so why torture myself? 

Three thoughts:

1. You've got a quest at lvl 25 to get D gear for free, so you shouldn't be in NG gear at 30.

2.  Just make a spoiler (or 2 or 3 or however many you need) and grind them to level 20 each.  It's really not much of a grind.  You can do it in 3-4 hours and end up with over 100,000 in adena and mats for each dwarf.  

3. They are supposed to be fixing the rates at the higher levels so don't give up yet.

[Arkaea]

Before, you could easily find a clan or group of people to play with. I have friends, whom I still speak today, who I've met on my very first experience in L2 15 years ago. Today, clans and groups want you to be nothing less than a hardcore player that has infinite time to play, login everyday, all day, and never give a no for an answer (kinda hard when you work and study full time even though I still manage to login everyday for a couple of hours). I was kicked from a clan, discord and blocked ingame because I got the flu and did not login for one day on the weekend (I confess I  was also not in the mood to wait over 12 hours in queue). That is why it is harder now than it was before. It's not the game, but the current state of mind of the community.

I don't even bother with clans anymore - and the freaking community is just getting worse by the day. L2 had the best multi-player community hands-down. Not anymore.

[ragingducks]

31 minutes ago, Arkaea said:

Before, you could easily find a clan or group of people to play with. I have friends, whom I still speak today, who I've met on my very first experience in L2 15 years ago. Today, clans and groups want you to be nothing less than a hardcore player that has infinite time to play, login everyday, all day, and never give a no for an answer (kinda hard when you work and study full time even though I still manage to login everyday for a couple of hours). I was kicked from a clan, discord and blocked ingame because I got the flu and did not login for one day on the weekend (I confess I  was also not in the mood to wait over 12 hours in queue). That is why it is harder now than it was before. It's not the game, but the current state of mind of the community.

I don't even bother with clans anymore - and the freaking community is just getting worse by the day. L2 had the best multi-player community hands-down. Not anymore.

There are casual clans as well. Join one.

[Arkaea]

They said they were casual.

[InLegends]

If you are burned out at 20 then nothing I will say will help you as it gets 100x worse.

[FatHips]

Honestly, the game isn't the old L2.  It's some masochistic interpretation of it bastardized by a free to play version that without a doubt has ruined the MMORPG genre.  In the old game, progression was pretty easy.  Leveling was slow, but you could progress realistically by many different means.  If you were efficient you could start with 10k adena and end up with millions having never left town.  That's how I did it.

They can still save it, but it involves making a freemium business model instead of the failed free to play model.

[Devoid]

6 minutes ago, FatHips said:

Honestly, the game isn't the old L2.  It's some masochistic interpretation of it bastardized by a free to play version that without a doubt has ruined the MMORPG genre.  In the old game, progression was pretty easy.  Leveling was slow, but you could progress realistically by many different means.  If you were efficient you could start with 10k adena and end up with millions having never left town.  That's how I did it.

They can still save it, but it involves making a freemium business model instead of the failed free to play model.

No. NCw is clearly minmaxing here, all the marketing is oriented towards the big spenders, casual spenders can gtfo since it takes less people, time and effort to handle support for a few hundred big spenders than to handle thousands of casual spenders (incl. additional servers that will need to be managed and maintained).

[FatHips]

At this point the game is worth playing, mostly because the community managers @Juji in particular have proven that they care about the sustainability of the project and are doing what they can to limit Korea from destroying it.  Retail and L2Revolution are huge jokes.  I don't even consider L2R a game much less Lineage.  It was nostalgic for a week and that was it.  It actually got me interested in playing classic, but I had no interest to commit to L2R.  You must be brain damaged if you like that game.

I have some faith at least and will continue to play.  I will keep VIP4 on a few accounts and hope that other people do as well, because NC has done some things right (not all) since the launch.

I'd be happy to pay 6-7 VIP4 accounts if I thought it was really worth it over free play, but it's not right now.  This is a huge problem for NC.

[Laser]

I have not had the best view of this "care about sustainability" you speak of @FatHips

I am constantly on the fence about quitting every second I play. I like the difficulty like this, even the limitations on adena rates that prevent the lead parties from gaining an insurmountable lead. I have a problem with how the game is being handled and multiple mutilations of the game code lingering from the Goddess update.

This is my L2 experience so far:

day 1 make 3 characters
day 2 banned for no reason and no explanation, unable to create new accounts. I took time off work and had a long weekend for this.
day 8 unbanned, no reason for ban or compensation given. create 3 characters for my 6 man party of supports.
day 9 banned for no reason, original 3 accounts untouched so i could do something with my now expired armor sets.
day 11 unbanned with no explanation of the ban. RIP both of the first weekends I finally get to play normally a full 2 weeks behind every other player because I have work
day 25 after being banned for no reason twice I really expected them to have a system that would keep afk bots out of the game. I get to see roughly 30% of newbie players running around as afk bots and adena spamming.

Today I posted constructive concepts encouraging useful discussion of solutions to adena spam sites and bot reporting. 

 

unable to purchase VIP to bypass 15 hour long queue until I can log in to buy VIP so I can bypass 15 long queue so I can pay for VIP so I can get past the queue so I can buy VIP --endlessly looped

 

AFK fishing is automated exp farm.

 

Multiple low/mid level hunting zones have level 70 mobs

 

Only 4 elements with fire wind water earth. I am have Necro and my friend is a Paladin. What do Dark and Holy element do now?

Vamp rage is supposed to be every hit
Reflect damage is supposed to only work on non skill melee damage
Magic damage is supposed to never miss. Physical skills still never miss

 

Endless list of missing or wrong skills such as:
emp echo missing
flame icon missing
bubble skills missing
frenzy missing. This skill was the namesake skill of the class. It has a skill called frenzy but the skill text and effects are wrong
angelic icon Give back the original version - said every paladin ever
skill enchant concept missing

 

 

 

 

My character has no underwear... Again. 

 

 

 

 

I have seen effort being attempted exclusively by @Juji, unfortunately ALL other support staff and mods I have talked with to give no explanation for any unacceptable actions.

I want to play, that should be clear given the things I have put up with. NC is currently panic fixing minor issues such as events giving a bit more exp than expected. 

We dont get to see any of the actions taken to remove illegal players. I would love to see a GM teleport every single bot at once into the sky above the tower of insolence where baium could then collectively 1 shot all of them in a glorious video for all to watch. Play with them first, then ban. Let people know when action is taken in a showy way. Just saying "we banned XXX number of illegal accounts today" feels so distant to players and we just see more bots pop up soon after. Help improve your own image.

 

I wanted to post with a positive view of things but putting that all in writing hurt.

[Sharlanna]

4 hours ago, Arkaea said:

Before, you could easily find a clan or group of people to play with. I have friends, whom I still speak today, who I've met on my very first experience in L2 15 years ago. Today, clans and groups want you to be nothing less than a hardcore player that has infinite time to play, login everyday, all day, and never give a no for an answer (kinda hard when you work and study full time even though I still manage to login everyday for a couple of hours). I was kicked from a clan, discord and blocked ingame because I got the flu and did not login for one day on the weekend (I confess I  was also not in the mood to wait over 12 hours in queue). That is why it is harder now than it was before. It's not the game, but the current state of mind of the community.

I don't even bother with clans anymore - and the freaking community is just getting worse by the day. L2 had the best multi-player community hands-down. Not anymore.

My VIP4 has 10 days left. I'm done and have gone back to Chronos. Wish you all the best but I refuse to "fill" NCsoft's pockets any longer.

[Amkzul]

6 hours ago, Oreoloveboss said:

That seems silly, I had a long sword for 70k at like level 18, Falchion at level 21 and bought a D grade saber at 23 or 24. Similar for friends who are playing too.

Yes it's a grind but it's fun to play in groups and there are always people looking at popular spots like AC or Orc Barracks. I just play casually but like above it can be fun, it's also rewarding to see your adena rise, sell your old gear and upgrade, it really feels like progress where other games just give you 'bind on equip' gear that becomes worthless once you put it on and outgrow it, making it feel like the stuff you've done up to this point was worthless.

To be fair if you are who I think you are you were one of the most hardcore players on devianne.  Ofcourse you had your gear early and quick.  Your average player though simply won't.

[Tinuphyl]

19 hours ago, Laser said:

I have not had the best view of this "care about sustainability" you speak of @FatHips

I am constantly on the fence about quitting every second I play. I like the difficulty like this, even the limitations on adena rates that prevent the lead parties from gaining an insurmountable lead. I have a problem with how the game is being handled and multiple mutilations of the game code lingering from the Goddess update.

This is my L2 experience so far:

day 1 make 3 characters
day 2 banned for no reason and no explanation, unable to create new accounts. I took time off work and had a long weekend for this.
day 8 unbanned, no reason for ban or compensation given. create 3 characters for my 6 man party of supports.
day 9 banned for no reason, original 3 accounts untouched so i could do something with my now expired armor sets.
day 11 unbanned with no explanation of the ban. RIP both of the first weekends I finally get to play normally a full 2 weeks behind every other player because I have work
day 25 after being banned for no reason twice I really expected them to have a system that would keep afk bots out of the game. I get to see roughly 30% of newbie players running around as afk bots and adena spamming.

Today I posted constructive concepts encouraging useful discussion of solutions to adena spam sites and bot reporting. 

 

unable to purchase VIP to bypass 15 hour long queue until I can log in to buy VIP so I can bypass 15 long queue so I can pay for VIP so I can get past the queue so I can buy VIP --endlessly looped

 

AFK fishing is automated exp farm.

 

Multiple low/mid level hunting zones have level 70 mobs

 

Only 4 elements with fire wind water earth. I am have Necro and my friend is a Paladin. What do Dark and Holy element do now?

Vamp rage is supposed to be every hit
Reflect damage is supposed to only work on non skill melee damage
Magic damage is supposed to never miss. Physical skills still never miss

 

Endless list of missing or wrong skills such as:
emp echo missing
flame icon missing
bubble skills missing
frenzy missing. This skill was the namesake skill of the class. It has a skill called frenzy but the skill text and effects are wrong
angelic icon Give back the original version - said every paladin ever
skill enchant concept missing

 

 

 

 

My character has no underwear... Again. 

 

 

 

 

I have seen effort being attempted exclusively by @Juji, unfortunately ALL other support staff and mods I have talked with to give no explanation for any unacceptable actions.

I want to play, that should be clear given the things I have put up with. NC is currently panic fixing minor issues such as events giving a bit more exp than expected. 

We dont get to see any of the actions taken to remove illegal players. I would love to see a GM teleport every single bot at once into the sky above the tower of insolence where baium could then collectively 1 shot all of them in a glorious video for all to watch. Play with them first, then ban. Let people know when action is taken in a showy way. Just saying "we banned XXX number of illegal accounts today" feels so distant to players and we just see more bots pop up soon after. Help improve your own image.

 

I wanted to post with a positive view of things but putting that all in writing hurt.

This.

[Tool_of_Society]

Day 1 saw me end up with three characters

Day 2 or 3 saw me add another knight (sws wannabe) to the group

Day or days after I decided to add a spoiler cause omg cash was bad

Day something after that I decided to add a magic user because I enjoyed the old necro days and I needed a hard hitter

Day 2 days ago I added a bow user because I also remember having enjoyed a dark elf bow user back in the early days. Now that weapons were being sold for cheap I took the dive

So now I'm at 7 characters and everytime I head out I get at least one captcha on someone lol. I like boxing and so grinding is almost a zen like experience as I repeat patterns and zone out a bit. With my current setup I basically use two spirit shots per mob and no soul shots.

Thankfully I've never had a ban problem. Possibly because I only log in at home on the same three desktops and laptop.

[FatHips]

@Laser I can't disagree with any of your points (frenzy really bothers me too).  I still believe @Juji and @Hime are doing what they can, but I also believe they are considerably hamstrung which is a shame.  This game can be so great with very small changes.

I hope they reconsider doing a proper freemium or pay to play relaunch.

[Tool_of_Society]

5 minutes ago, FatHips said:

@Laser I can't disagree with any of your points (frenzy really bothers me too).  I still believe @Juji and @Hime are doing what they can, but I also believe they are considerably hamstrung which is a shame.  This game can be so great with very small changes.

I hope they reconsider doing a proper freemium or pay to play relaunch.

That's been the history of Ncwest in general..

[solidpt]

fix the armour and weapon mob drop , more % : will fix all the problems that we  have, adena is fine , xp is fine , DROPS are not fine

[FatHips]

15 minutes ago, solidpt said:

fix the armour and weapon mob drop , more % : will fix all the problems that we  have, adena is fine , xp is fine , DROPS are not fine

that's kind of ironic, as drop rates are higher relative than adena or spoils

XP is too high if you ask me but I don't think it matters a lot.

Adena and spoils have to be fixed for sure, and for VIP only so it encourages people to pay VIP and thus NC has secure revenue.

[solidpt]

15 minutes ago, FatHips said:

that's kind of ironic, as drop rates are higher relative than adena or spoils

XP is too high if you ask me but I don't think it matters a lot.

Adena and spoils have to be fixed for sure, and for VIP only so it encourages people to pay VIP and thus NC has secure revenue.

example , been trying to get NG bow from suposely this mob for past 3 days playing 3/4h a day , nothing , drop is low , this is quite annoying and boring and that way makes people stop playig this. i played classic in the past,i know how it works and i love it,  but nowadays L2 is not rewarding enough.....

[FatHips]

1 minute ago, solidpt said:

example , been trying to get NG bow from suposely this mob for past 3 days playing 3/4h a day , nothing , drop is low , this is quite annoying and boring and that way makes people stop playig this. i played classic in the past,i know how it works and i love it,  but nowadays L2 is not rewarding enough.....

I have not gotten a full weapon drop making five chars to level 40 (all VIP3-4) of any grade.  I do not think that is abnormal, they are quite rare.  But aside from that I feel you.  Adena drops and spoils being low is the main problem, regular drops are actually the least important part of the L2 economy.

[solidpt]

i love the feeling of classic , and i dont mind with the current adena and xp rates, what bothers me the most is the fact i try farm for weapons in specific mobs for hours and nothing , i have no progression at all , its like you lv 50+ and you have a NG weapon,sucks

and some of my friends sto playing the game cause of that.